Why the Big Ten Hate?
For about three weeks now I have been telling everyone who would listen one simple thing: the Big 12 is overrated. I usually get the same response from just about everyone, including Big Ten fans, that I am nuts. But the past few days I have been really thinking it through. The obvious reason I feel the conference is not any good is the lack of defense in the conference. We are, as Mike so aptly put it, arbitrarily attaching value to teams based upon that team(s) body of work in conference this year. Somewhere, somebody got the idea that the Big 12 was “the” conference this year. They were supported by the gaudy offensive numbers, the star studded names, and personalities that litter the conference. But where has the defense been all season? How can you say the number 1 team in the country is the same team that gives up 24.5 points per game? Just because they beat Texas Tech, 26.25 points per game? Just because they beat Missouri? Please 27.5 points per game! The only "good" defense they faced was Texas who gives up 18.5 points per game. Guess what that result was! Someone needs to dig up a Greek philosopher so we can get someone to use reason here.
Well based on the above someone will jump in here and say you’re a Big Ten fan your conference sucks. The reason we suck? The most common answer is the Ohio State flops of the past two years. Is that the reason? Really? We penalize a whole conference because of two seasons worth of flops? Someone must have forgot about this, and this, and this, and this. Let us see; since 2005 the number one team in the nation is 0-4 in the BCS including two back to back BCS championship flops, a loss to Boise State, and to West Virginia. In those 2 BCS championship games they were out scored by 43 combined points. Ohio State in the past two years lost by 41 combined points. Not much of a case there OU fans. Don’t bring up that National championship in 2000 either, Ohio State got one in 2002. Also how do you explain the 2007 Fiesta Bowl? Or the 2008 Fiesta Bowl when they lost 48-28 to WVU? I am not sure you can. But that won’t stop the pundits from proclaiming the Big 12’s dominance and the “weakness” of the Big Ten.
I just wish that people would be fair in their assessments of teams. Too often people take the trendy, style point rich teams and inflate their value. The reasoning that puts the one loss Big 12 teams ahead of any one loss Big Ten team is off base and lacks supporting evidence. Too bad most of the world has forgotten articles like these.
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22 comments
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I agree
The reality is that the Big Ten is the biggest conference in sports. It has the largest TV market and the largest alumni base. This means that the rest of the country sees the Big Ten every week, both because of the Big Ten alumni being spread across the country and because the Big Ten’s massive financial clout supersedes the other conferences.
Somewhat understandably fans of the other conferences get a little sick of hearing about a conference which they see as far away and irrelevant to their interests. As a result, everyone has jumped on the opportunity to lay down low the Big Ten. Of course the other side of this argument is that eventually the CFB world will right itself, and the Big Ten will reassert itself and retake it’s position more inline with it’s size and influence.
by AgnosticTheocrat on Dec 8, 2008 3:04 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
There are some valid points for the Big 10 being down other than OSU flopping
and they have to do with the conferences record against other conferences in OOC games. Unfortunately, those early season games pin down where the conferences are relative to each other, and don’t really change much in perception afterwards. Also, unfortunately, the OOC games that have teams with ranks next to their names are taken more seriously than the OOC games where one or both teams aren’t ranked (see #1 USC vs #5 O$U compared to #19 PSU vs NR OrSt)
by The JuggerNitt on Dec 8, 2008 3:56 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Penn St. at Ohio St. sums it all up
This was the marque game of the season for the Big Ten and the winner was the Big Ten champion.
The game was highly promoted, 8pm, primetime, College Gameday, the works.
The game was an absolute monster of a defensive battle, and went into the 4th quarter 3-6. The game ended at 13-6.
The average fan watches football simply for offense, TD passes especially. There were no TD passes in this game, there weren’t even a RB running TD, just a QB sneak.
Most of the country compared what they had just seen to the Texas Missouri game from the week before (also 8pm primetime I believe), the score: 56-31.
Fans and announcers alike were bored watching a defensive battle, and likewise they were exhilerated watching TD pass after TD pass.
The conclusion most analysts, fans, and voters came to was that the Big Ten was a boring slow conference compared to the Big 12. Big 12 = ratings, Big 10 = zzz’s. So they began hyping the Big 12 by any means necessary: Heisman talk for all the QB’s, artificially inflating the hype, excessive coverage of the conference and teams, all the games went to primetime, and as a result all the voters pumped up the rankings.
by millzners on Dec 8, 2008 4:16 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Very true
People expect in this era of football to be treated to a shootout game where the last team with the ball wins the game. The same thing happens in other sports… who likes a basketball game where Princeton wins 48-43, or a 1-0 pitcher’s duel in baseball?
The Ohio State game was awesome. I’ve never been so on the edge of my seat, knowing that one mistake would doom one of the teams. There’s no room for error- one misstep by one player cost their team the game. What more can you ask for to have two teams play nearly flawless games? However, the media called that game “ugly,” “archaic,” or at best, “a defensive slugfest.” The media, and many fans, view this style of game as if the players are out there in rugby attire, leather helmets, and gouging eyes after every scrum.
This leads to an environment where Penn State, as part of the Big 10, is seen as some sort of throwback to the era of the flying wedge who can’t score. Never mind we had games this year where we dropped 66, 45, 55, 45, 48, 46, and 49 points on teams this year. Clearly, there is a dearth of offense in the Big 10.
To be fair though, there was no shortage of primetime coverage for the Big Ten this year. Penn State played twice at night, Ohio State 3 times, Wisconsin 2, Illinois 2. Media coverage isn’t going to be a problem for any good BCS conference team. I don’t suscribe to any theory that the Big 10 is underrepresented in media coverage. There’s a lot of fans of Big 10 schools that any sensible media outlet needs to keep interested, just like the fans of every other major conference. There’s a lot of factors in play… and most of them involve Ohio State shitting the bed in the past few championship games. Until the conference earns some tangible respect back (winning our BCS game will certainly help), we’ll hear this for a few years. Towards the end of this season, most media types seemed to come around to the fact that the SEC has two great teams and that’s about it. Things are cyclical and will continue to be. Let’s wait and see what happens to the Big 12 this bowl season.
On the upside, I really don’t work with any Big 12 fans. I’m sure their fans are just as obnoxious, but I don’t hear the banter on a daily basis. It’s much worse when the SEC and ACC are on the up and up…
by shadowfax on Dec 8, 2008 5:04 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Defense!
I would much rather watch a defensive battle, hearing the crunch of the hits, and watching Hoyer lay on the field in pain than watch a pretty boy throw the ball a million times. If you can score 60+ points, good for you, but if your opponent scores 50+ you are not a well rounded team. Period.
by letsgopsu on Dec 8, 2008 5:09 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Hits!
Remember that hit Scirotto put on the Tennessee receiver in 2007? It looked like the receiver got hit buy a missile. He rolled around in pain, tried to stand up, then crumpled back to the ground on his hands and knees and took an injury timeout.
That receiver didn’t do a whole lot after that, although he did have a few catches (one on the next play).
My point is, that that hit is 10x better than some 60 yard TD pass, at least in my book.
by millzners on Dec 8, 2008 5:20 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Amen
Remember in 2005 when MRob hit the Minnesota player? Classic.
by letsgopsu on Dec 8, 2008 5:41 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Another great moment in that game
Minni with the ball on the 1 and the Minni running back meets Poz in mid air in is stopped dead:
by whiteoutonly on Dec 9, 2008 1:56 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I loved the hit
I mean our friggen QB layed out their safety. It just sucks that he was a really talented Safety and after that injury (broke something, but I forget what) he could never play again.
by The JuggerNitt on Dec 9, 2008 2:22 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
This is a clearly hypothetical thought, coming from an outsider, and fellow "your conference is weak" guy
But people hate Ohio State. Their fans, their coach, everything about them. Same thing with USC. The similarities are staggering:
So everyone hates USC and Ohio State; the only difference between the YCS (your conference sucks) debates is that USC wins its big non-conference games, therefore, the Pac10 is looked at as “USC and everyone else.” Ohio State loses its non-conference games, but remains on top of the Big10, so it’s “Big 10 sucks.” You bring up great points about Oklahoma’s flops in the BCS. But remember, those games were highlighted by things bigger than Oklahoma losing: 1. Boise State winning that miracle of a game was the highlight; 2. West Virginia, after losing RRod, and coming out and winning was the highlight. In Ohio State’s first loss to Florida, it was such a monumental flop for OSU (who had a Heisman Trophy winner and was considered the “giant” of that year) that it over shadowed the win for a talented UF team. And then, last year, it was all about how Ohio State shouldn’t be there and the OMG ESS EEE SEE is so much faster, so everyone was expecting a blowout, and when it happened, that’s all anyone would talk about.
It’s a combination of perception and sex appeal. The Big 12 had some of the “sexiest” names in CFB entering this year: Bradford, McCoy, Harrell, Crabtree, Daniel, Reesing, etc. The SEC had it’s share, but lost a lot of luster when LSU, Georgia, and Auburn fell off the map— all teams with HUGE expectations for this year. The Big 10 had, what I would call, 2 “sexy” names coming into this year, and one was a true freshman: Wells and Pryor.
What I find most interesting is SEC pundits touting their conference strength, saying how many teams were in the top 10, top 5, or even top 2 this year. They spout how Georgia and LSU were in the top 2 at some point this year— both finished with less-than-stellar records. Auburn was also in the top 10 (finished 5-7). I mean, yes, the rankings are great and all, but what does it mean if you don’t have teams finish.
I am one of the few fans of the current system we have: I hate, hate, HATE the idea of a playoff. I hate it in all sports. A champion should be decided by the regular season. A team like USC, who is known for stepping up in big games, would THRIVE in a playoff, where every week is against a Florida, a Penn State, a Texas, etc. What does that prove if they can’t beat Oregon State, or UCLA, or Stanford. I think winning the games you’re supposed to win should count more than losing games against close competition. However, all that being said, this year kind of changed my mind. A playoff was really the only way to decide it. And it wasn’t like there were so many teams that “deserve” to be in the championship, more as, there’s no way to find the teams that were least deserving. Fact is, USC beats Oregon State, they are in. Penn State beats Iowa, you’re in. Florida beats Ole Miss at home, they’re in. I feel for Alabama, I really do. They didn’t lose to anybody they should have beaten. Florida did. And yet, they have the same record, and UF is in the championship.
Sorry for that last rant, I don’t know where it came from. But anyways, the point is, perception is everything. Sexiness is everything. And hate is everything. People are going to continue to hate Ohio State, and therefore, they are going to hate the Big 10 as long as tOSU is on top. Same with the Pac10.
I support Takimoto in his effort to support Roger Kieschnick in his quest to becoming the best Kieschnick ever to play professional baseball.
by The VD Special on Dec 8, 2008 4:31 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Sexiness
I had this discussion with someone recently.
If college football was Gilligan’s Island, Penn State would be Maryann. USC, Florida, etc would be Ginger. Ask most guys who they would like to visit the quiet side of the island with and they would say Maryann. It’s a fact. Ask around the office. The problem is most of the media (the Gilligans of the world) don’t want to admit that they would also rather be with Maryann, so they make fun of her and her plain clothes. But they’re the ones missing out.
by NJ lion on Dec 8, 2008 4:41 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I woulda taken either (or both!) of them to the quiet side of the island.
…hell, even Mrs. Howell woulda looked good after a while…
wait… what we were talkin about? ;)
I refuse to join any club that would have me as a member
by TheMightyErik on Dec 8, 2008 5:52 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
thanks for getting me back on track... got lost there for a second
I refuse to join any club that would have me as a member
by TheMightyErik on Dec 8, 2008 9:41 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Word

Agreed: it’s Mary Ann allll daaayy!
pax et amor
by jtothep on Dec 8, 2008 11:13 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Although
Mrs. Howell and Ginger come in a close 2 & 3 here:

pax et amor
by jtothep on Dec 8, 2008 11:16 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
fuggin A....
I actually looked at some of these pics earlier. MaryAnn’s mugshot after getting busted with the chronic a year or two ago made me laugh out loud. Now THERE’S a chick that I woulda liked to partaaaay with on that island. What’s with that clown hat on that cougar Mrs H?
I refuse to join any club that would have me as a member
by TheMightyErik on Dec 8, 2008 11:30 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I know, right?
Couldn’t bring myself to post her pot arrest mug shot, but love where her head is at.
You could play that rodeo game where you wrestle that cougar from behind and call out ‘Ginger’ or ‘MaryAnn’ and see how long that hat stays on.
pax et amor
by jtothep on Dec 9, 2008 1:50 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Well regardless of the past two Fiesta Bowls
how do you explain away the championship game flops by OU?
You cannot, they are there and are overlooked when it is convienient to do so. After Florida rips them a new one, which I do believe will happen (If you haven’t watched SEC football this year, you have no idea how incredible these defenses are, they are fast, they are nasty, and they are better than the BIG 12) the media will again espouse how OU and “Big game Bob” have flopped again and how the system is flawed.
Success without honor is like an unseasoned dish, it will fill you up but it won't taste good. - Joe V. Paterno
by carolinaeasy on Dec 9, 2008 7:31 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
The ideal......
scenario is PSU and OSU rip USC and Texas and then Oklahoma rips Florida. Then both the SEC and the BIG 12 appear over rated.
Eric Watters Atlanta, Ga.
by ech2os on Dec 9, 2008 10:12 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
That is what I hope happens, but what "they" will say afterwards is...
I guess Texas wasn’t that good & Oklahoma’s loss was a fluke. Oklahoma is really great & the BigXII is really great & the OMG ESS EEE SEE is really great. Oh yeah & the Big 10 and Pac 10 still suck.
Born and raised in the shadow of Mount Nittany
by Elihu on Dec 9, 2008 1:28 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I say that.......
because I really can’t stomach another Florida NC.
Eric Watters Atlanta, Ga.
by ech2os on Dec 9, 2008 10:12 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

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