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Making The Case For: Playing Both Clark and Devlin


Clarkanddevlin_medium

Quarterbacks: They're important. This is the final in a short series in which we will try to decipher which quarterback will give the team the best chance to win.

It has been one of the hottest topics of discussion among PSU fans all summer long. Should we take a shot on the African American quarterback just because his Alamo Bowl performance reminds us of Michael Robinson and ignore the fact he hasn't proven anything in the passing game? Or should we take a chance on another five star Pennsylvania quarterback with an impressive high school resume with just one pass attempt in two years and hope he's more Kerry Collins than Anthony Morelli? 

Star-divide

On Monday you heard Kevin give the case why Daryll Clark should be our quarterback.

So In Conclusion: Clark brings the whole package to an offense that desperately needs both options and confidence, both of which he can provide.  One of the things that made Robinson great was his ability to overcome some of the terrible play calling from the OC(s).  When the coaches showed their lack of creativity, MRob forced defenses to continue to play him straight up because of the different options he brought to the table.

Clark does those same things.   A minor detail, yet still relatively telling, is the fact that Rodriguez was interested in Clark and, coincidently, the Spread HD will probably share quite a few characteristics with new Michigan offense.  Besides having the talent to both run and pass in that type of system, he brings an attitude and sense of urgency that is more than welcome at this point.

And yesterday we heard RUTS plead his case for Pat Devlin.

In Conclusion: The reality is that while Devlin and Clark are sloppily labeled as the throwing and running quarterbacks, respectively, they're more similar than people think.  The question, then, comes down to, "What does this offense need most to succeed?"  We already know the Penn State offensive line is going to create problems for defensive coordinators, who quickly tire of their defensive fronts giving up 6+ yards per carry.  When the defense brings that extra defender toward the line of scrimmage, which quarterback do you want behind center in order to exploit the thinned-out secondary?  Who do you trust more to make the big play through the air?  No offense to fans of Daryll Clark, but if I have to pick one guy, give me the quarterback who ran a pass-happy spread offense in high school and doesn't need to be coached up quite as much -- Pat Devlin.

Both of them make excellent points. I can't make up my mind which guy I like better. Truthfully, I would be comfortable with either of them lining up under center when the season starts. So in my mind there can be only one solution: Play them both.

At this point the defense submits Exihibit A: The Oregon Ducks. Last season the Chartreuse Warriors started out firing on all cylinders on the legs and arm of their electrifying quarterback Dennis Dixon. A week two annihilation of Michigan was followed by a shocking upset of the USC Trojans. Sitting at 8-1 the Ducks found themselves ranked #2 in the BCS and in control of their own destiny. With the leading Heisman candidate on their team and a manageable schedule going forward it didn't appear anything was in the way of preventing Oregon from competing in the BCS championship game.

And then in the first quarter of their game against Arizona disaster struck when Dennis Dixon tore his ACL ending not only his season, but also the season of an entire school and fanbase. Oregon went on to lose that game. And then they followed it up with a 16-0 loss to UCLA and a double overtime loss to Oregon State. The offense without Dixon was never the same.
 

With Dixon Without Dixon
Rushing YPG 271 159
Passing YPG 239 158
Points/game 42.8 18.3

In four weeks the Oregon Ducks went from living out a BCS dream season with a Heisman Trophy quarterback to riding a three game losing streak and backing their way into the Sun Bowl. The moral of the story is always have a backup ready to go.

Lou Holtz is fond of saying "If you have two quarterbacks, you don't have a quarterback." Maybe this was true 20 years ago, but the game has changed in recent years. As the game becomes more and more complicated the players become more and more specialized. It's not uncommon to see most teams utilize a platoon of running backs. You have your first and second down guy. Then you have your third down guy for running passing routes. You have your short yardage guy. You have your blocking back if you need extra protection in the pocket.  On the defensive line you have your run specialists and your pass rush specialists. Heck, some teams have field goal kickers and another guy they use for kickoffs. It only stands to reason that with time the quarterback position will evolve to where you use different guys for different situations. Urban Meyer somewhat led the way in this regard when Florida won the 2006 National Championship on the arm of Chris Leak and the legs of Tim Tebow.

But even if Penn State doesn't plan on using a Chris Leak/Tim Tebow type setup, it's still a good idea to play both guys at least early on. If Jay and Joe plan on returning to the spread offense we saw with Michael Robinson in 2005, you can bet the quarterback, whoever he is, is going to take a beating. If you're going to run your quarterback between the tackles you better be prepared when he gets injured. If the guy sitting on the bench has one career pass attempt you can bet your poor preparation will ruin the hopes and dreams of 100 other players and millions of fans.

But then I shouldn't have to lecture Penn State fans on the value of developing your backup quarterback. In 2006 we all had high hopes for Anthony Morelli. We were all convinced he was going to destroy the school passing records even though he only had 20 pass attempts the year before. We quickly learned in week two against Notre Dame that Anthony Morelli was not adequately prepared to lead our team. Now skip ahead to the Michigan game. Morelli finally appeared to be getting his act together. He wasn't looking sensational, but he was managing the game well and had Penn State right in there. And then...

Flattened_medium

Daryll Clark came in and looked like a deer caught in the headlights. Every time he found his primary target covered he panicked tucking the ball under his arm and running until he eventually got himself knocked out of the game as well.

So the answer is simple. Play them both. You call both guys in the office on day one and tell them they are both going to play. When one guy scores I expect the other guy to cheer. When one guy is down I expect the other guy to pick him up. Start one guy and let him play a quarter or at least two series. Then bring in the other guy for a few series. At halftime you evaluate their performance and play the guy the defense has a tougher time dealing with. By the time the conference schedule rolls around you have two guys each with 100 meaningful snaps under their belt that the team and coaches can have confidence in. This is what Penn State needs to do.

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Comments

Display:

question

So are you saying that they should play 2 qb’s like you mention in your last paragraph for the entire season, or just a few games? If it is just for the first 4 games, where does psu go from there?

"Boy that student section now is up and really making a gigantic amount of noise. You see the sea of white, the white out. Well they are 2 minutes and 28 seconds away from the whiteout of the Buckeyes here tonight." - Ron Franklin

by rmcmillen50 on Aug 13, 2008 8:28 AM EDT reply reply actions actions   0 recs

A11 offense

I would love to see some of this incorporated into our HD offense. Both QB’s line up and everyone is available for a pass. I am all for getting experience with both Clark and Devlin, but it cannot be alternating series. That just screws up the entire offense, especially if you have 2 quarterbacks that have different styles of play, no one gets into a groove.

I don't know, Mello Yello is pretty awful. What's the worst that could happen?

by psu on Aug 13, 2008 8:48 AM EDT reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Not likely.

The A-11 offense relies on a scrimmage kick numbering exception and is at its heart a gimmick. If it reaches any point of significance in college football, it is very likely the rules will be amended to prevent it.

by gumbercules on Aug 13, 2008 11:13 AM EDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Oregon State - First true test for both quarterbacks

I’m looking forward to Oregon State game. It’ll be first true test for both quarterbacks. That team is no cupcake and they can be a challenge for the Nittany Lions team. If either quarterbacks or both do well against Oregon State then I will believe they do well in conference games.

by DeafPSUFan on Aug 13, 2008 8:52 AM EDT reply reply actions actions   0 recs

2 QB system but you need 1 top guy

I would like to see them run a 2 QB system as in if one guy is not on his game they are not afraid of changing QBs, but you need that 1 guy that you put in when it is a close game. For example who would you play if it was the 4Q tied game with 5 mins left. You also need that one guy that the team looks up to.

by jetskijoe on Aug 13, 2008 8:55 AM EDT reply reply actions actions   0 recs

That's Why you Always Start Clark

If its true that Paterno has any undying loyalty to his starting QB (see Mills ‘04, and QB #14’s “confidence” in ‘07), then he should have no problem naming a starting QB and annointing him team leader even if another is playing a significant number of snaps, right?

I like the idea of 2 QBs on the field at the same time like they did when Clark would come in during the Alamo Bowl. Sure there’s no way in hell Morelli was going to do anything lined up outside, but put Clark out there and Devlin in the gun and things change. RB draws, quick hitters, quick screens/screen fakes to Clark. It puts a D on their heels when they dont know what QB is going to be under center when a team’s in the huddle.

3 great posts all around gentlemen. Let’s hope the powers-that-be inside the Lasch Building are picking up on this stuff as well. Speaking of good ol’ Lasch, can we get an on campus update? Is there still a draft in the building? Has the kid gone to court? How many hits does he have on facebook?

by The IC Lion on Aug 13, 2008 9:05 AM EDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Evaluate, start the guy with the most raw potential

There’s a reason Clark reminds us of Mrob, it’s not so much the color of their skin or the running as it is that diving TD to tie things up in the Alamo bowl.

You have a QB with his first meaningful snaps ever, on the road, in a bowl game, and down by a TD. Despite the fact that he was certain to run, the defense couldn’t stop him. Two guys on the goal line could have stopped him if he had put his shoulder down—and then the gutless play-calling would have certainly yielded a field goal. Instead he went balls-out (literally) and dove for the TD. Yeah he fumbled, but he also showed that spark MRob had that Morelli didn’t.

I look at Devlin, I see Mills, Morelli, etc. I see a kid who has great talent and needs a decent coach to help him develop in to a big-time D-I QB. We don’t have that coach.

by millzners on Aug 13, 2008 9:07 AM EDT reply reply actions actions   0 recs

take it easy...

on Zach Mills. Just because he was the feature qb of the dark years, doesn’t mean he’s comparable to Morelli.

by spakajewia on Aug 13, 2008 10:10 AM EDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

i agree

it is not mills’ fault he had to play with garbage and a bum shoulder.

lest we forget, mills came in for an injured seneca and won that northwestern game.

JD

by psudrozz on Aug 13, 2008 10:32 AM EDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Do you see one of them leaving then

Lets say Clark gets the starting job does that mean Devlin transfers to a different school. Or lets say Devlin gets the starting job does that mean Clark transfers. I think they both could be great QBs. I guess another question is whoever starts year do they automatically get the start for next year? I would think it depends on performance but we saw how #14 did.

by jetskijoe on Aug 13, 2008 9:38 AM EDT reply reply actions actions   0 recs

i think we've turned a leaf

i know this is going out on a limb but i think the coaches (well, joe) might have learned their lesson…that’s a bold statement, but we aren’t dealing with 12 year old egos anymore so that should no longer factor into the decision.

Clark has come out and said things like “Devlin and I bring a lot of talent”, so he doesn’t seem the bitter type. If he doesn’t get the starting role, he is athletic enough to use in certain situations (goaline options plays, for example). There was a lot of talk about Devlin transferring but I don’t know how much validity there was to it. Worst case: he is the true #2 qb and doesn’t get meaningful snaps (something I think is not likly), he’s only one injury away from playing. A transfer means he is down to two years of eligibility.

It looks like, if we don’t use them both all year, they will at least both get a chance to prove themselves in non-league play…that’s really all you can ask for.

by Kevin HD on Aug 13, 2008 10:10 AM EDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Transfer

I do not think you lose eligibility when you transfer.

So, if Devlin transfers he would still have 3 years left.

by DrDetroit on Aug 13, 2008 10:18 AM EDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

you lose a year if you transfer to a D-1 school

For the Glory; National Champions 1982, 1986, 1994,

by jesse. on Aug 13, 2008 10:19 AM EDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

You sit out a year

But I don’t think you lose a year.

by BSD on Aug 13, 2008 10:28 AM EDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I think that's only true

If you still have a redshirt available.

by Run Up The Score on Aug 13, 2008 10:36 AM EDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

From the Horse's Mouth!

Five-year clock — If you play at a Division I
school, you have five calendar years in which
to play four seasons of competition — even
if you sit out a year, even if you go part-time
during your college career. Your five-year
clock starts the minute you become a fulltime
student at any college.

http://www.drexeldragons.com/Pdfs/gen/2007/11/2/2007-08_transfer_guide.pdf

So, if he transfers he will indeed lose a year of eligibility if he can not get an exception to the one year sitting out requirement.

by DrDetroit on Aug 13, 2008 11:28 AM EDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   1 recs

A Return to '04

Am I the only one here who remember’s the ‘04 season where we played the 2 qb system (Zack Mills & MRob)? Does anyone remember how that one worked out? If we play a two qb system I have a terrible feeling that the results will mirror that season.

by jcierski on Aug 13, 2008 10:08 AM EDT reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Bit of an oversimplification don't you think?

There is a pretty big differential in talent between this years team, and the 2004 team. Experience too.

For the Glory; National Champions 1982, 1986, 1994,

by jesse. on Aug 13, 2008 10:12 AM EDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

agreed...

‘04 didn’t have the o-line or anywhere near the wide receiving corps of this team.

by spakajewia on Aug 13, 2008 10:12 AM EDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

2 different years,

2 different QB’s, all different players…

That is a ” s t r e t c h e d ” comparison…only the title is the same…

Old School... MEETS New School!

by BlueWhiteLife on Aug 13, 2008 10:42 AM EDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

2 QB's

We have a lot more talent at the skill positions than we did back then so condemning all 2 QB systems based on those teams doesn’t make sense.

by BSD on Aug 13, 2008 10:13 AM EDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Indeed

Remember PSU started 9-0 with a 2 QB system in Kevin Thompson and Rashard Casey.

I think Clark/Devlin are different from the 1999 and 2004 QB’s in that Clark/Devlin are very similar types of QB’s. The other tandems featured two very different quarterbacks which required a different offensive setups determined by who was lining up behind center. Additionally, the offensive guys surrounding the 2008 QB’s are more experienced and deeper than both earlier squads. Both factors increase the comfort level of players in the offense. I really believe the offense will be at it’s best with a 2 QB system. It doesn’t mean the coaching staff won’t throw out the system the day before the Wisconsin game, but we’ll see what happens.

by Cairo on Aug 13, 2008 10:37 AM EDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

1999....

Worked out pretty well for us until Minnesota crushed our chances.

And I think we used a quasi 2qb system in 1996 with Wally and Big Red.

by Screen Name 20 on Aug 13, 2008 11:33 AM EDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I'd like to throw MY name into the mix

I’ll be blogging about this later as to why I should be the starting quarterback.

On a serious note, I do support the 2QB system, but I don’t expect to see anything to fancy in the opener. I look forward to the Oregon State game, as mentioned earlier. I think the Oregon State game will be the litmus test for what we say the rest of the season. If we see a 2QB attack, but one QB struggles, his season could be doomed.

Kevin

by kevinmc on Aug 13, 2008 11:19 AM EDT reply reply actions actions   0 recs

2 vs. 1

The simple reality is that a 2 QB system is rarely better than a 1 QB system. Look at the Top 5 teams over the past decade and you will see virtually all have a 1 QB system. The only exception, as I can see, is (a) when a school actually has two proven top tier QBs on the roster, and (b) when they have an equally strong coaching staff that can develop each individual QB and the 2-QB system.

Unfortunately Penn State does not (yet) have 2 legitimate top tier QBs (only have high school stats to really go on) and,more importantly, has consistently shown to be weak at developing QB talent. As such, I really believe going with a 2 QB plan will be an utter disaster. Hope they pick one and do their best to develop him and a gameplan that leverages his abilities.

by Bud249 on Aug 13, 2008 11:30 AM EDT reply reply actions actions   0 recs

... however ...

... am all for using both against the Chanticleers to see who fares best in a (sort of) real game situation, before settling on #1 for the season.

by Bud249 on Aug 13, 2008 11:33 AM EDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

A two qb system

... has a lot more potential for hang-ups than for wild successes, at least in my opinion. We saw this in Ann Arbor when there would be ludicrous set-ups for playing time between Tom Brady and Drew Henson… sometimes it worked, and sometimes it was quite evident that it completely robbed the team of any sort of momentum and rhythm. You also open up the door for all kinds of club-house issues and you certainly are begging for your own built-in “QB controversy” the second one plays the tiniest bit better than the other. It’s a ticking time bomb more often than not.

I think that there are a few things that need to be considered here:

1. Jay-Pa has been anywhere from bad to gawd-awful in developing quarterbacks over the years, which certainly has to cast some doubt into the equation as to how he will do trying to juggle and manage two young QB’s at the same time. I don’t mean that as a slam so much as a point that definitely needs to be considered. Brian over at mgoblog had a great breakdown of your passing efficiency over the years:

2007 – 74th
2006 – 92nd
2005 – 53rd
2004 – 111th
2003 – 100th
2002 – 45th
2001 – 83rd
2000 – 74th

Needless to say, it’s hard to look at this track record and see any PSU QB blossoming into something they aren’t already as long as Jay Pa is still at the controls.

2. I cannot name the last team that ran a true two-quarterback system and was really really good… I don’t think you can count Florida in ‘06 as Tebow came in to simply run the football with the occasional pass, a much more situational approach. Honestly, though, thinking back over the years I cannot think of a team that was able to successfully using a two-qb system to make a run at either the Big 10 title or the national title. OSU had Stanley Jackson and Joe Germaine in ‘97… any others I’m forgetting?

3. “The similar type of QBs” argument. I dont’ see this one as I think Clark’s mobility is what Jay Pa is trying to take advantage of with this “new” offense, or more accurately: trying to recapture 2005’s approach. Now granted I don’t keep my finger on the pulse of your program like you guys do, but from the limited amount I have seen, calling their skill sets “similar” is certainly a bit of a stretch. This isn’t a bad thing, but do you think that the coaches will be able to adapt the offense to two different types of approaches based upon who is in there? Did Clark even throw a pass in the bowl game last year? I don’t recall one, but I may be mistaken. Devlin might also be nimble, but I think if you take a long hard look at their strengths, calling them similar is a bit of a mis-label. With two different QBs getting playing time, you’re relying pretty heavily on your coaching staff to have an effective game plan for both… I think we can all see where I’m going with this…

4. It’s a “touchy feely” point, but perhaps the most important of all of them: who is going to be the more natural leader and who is going to have the confidence of the other 10 guys in the huddle? Can you guys say that the attitude of the rest of the team won’t be affected by having rotating QBs? I think history will prove otherwise. Your QB this year isn’t going to have to go out and be able to make every throw and read in the book, there’s enough experience elsewhere that that won’t be the case, but they will have to be able to manage the game and make the occasional play when it’s needed, and being able to step into the huddle and have all 11 guys ready to go when you need it most is certainly an important factor. Again, it gets back to that whole “rhythm” point…

Essentially I think you end up with an awful lot more questions than answers by trying to cater to both players, and I think in the long-run, your team in particular would be much better served by some stability at the QB position.

Just an outsiders perspective…

Go Blue!

by ThoseWhoStay on Aug 13, 2008 11:32 AM EDT reply reply actions actions   0 recs

... makes me yearn ...

... for the good old years when we were 45th in efficiency.

by Bud249 on Aug 13, 2008 11:36 AM EDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

No one can stress this one point enough:

Jay Paterno is a terrible, aweful QB coach. It really doesn’t matter if today’s Tom Brady or a red-shirt senior T. Pryor, or Joe friggin Montana is our QB. You cannot expect our QB situation to be anything better than below average, and even that is asking too much.

Until Jay goes, don’t hold out hope for a good QB, don’t even think about 1994.

Jay will disappoint us this season. He will force our QB’s to underperform. He will call plays that can’t possibly work, and those numbers will reflect on the QB at the end of the day.

When Jay calls for some razzle-dazzle mushy out-pattern 9 yards deep when it’s 3rd and 10 in the 3rd quarter against OSU—I hope people remember not to blame the QB or the receiver.

by millzners on Aug 13, 2008 11:58 AM EDT reply reply actions actions   0 recs

My Problems with a Possible 2 QB System...

are things I don’t think have been brought up yet. If we assume PSU tries it as a situational option (as opposed to a series-by-series change, as suggested by BSD), I see the following happening:

1) Several plays where Clark comes in at QB and Devlin gets split out. This was a playbook staple during the MRob/Mills era that indicated 98%* of the time a run was coming. We saw signs of it returning during the bowl game with Clark/Morelli. You could argue that they could conceivably switch the QB’s considering both are mobile, but I still think the play is dumb. If you are willing to throw QB-to-QB, you’re putting an important player at risk for more physical abuse. If you aren’t willing, you’re playing 10-on-11.

2) Lots of Delay of Game penalties and wasted timeouts. Ga-Hall/Jay-Pa have enough trouble squabbling over whether a run or pass should be called. Then they gotta decide which QB is in. The MRob/Mills era was filled with these dumb mistakes that cost the team important yards and precious timeouts.

  • Percentage is based off a bitter recollection of horrible play-calling, not on actual data.

by Kunk on Aug 13, 2008 1:26 PM EDT reply reply actions actions   0 recs

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