Wlat Knows Best: How Joe Paterno Retroactively (And Hypothetically) Screwed Larry Fitzgerald
by Run Up The Score on Jan 26, 2009 12:30 PM EST
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PrintI've been blankly staring at this PennLive.com article on Larry Fitzgerald for a few minutes and trying to understand. Maybe you can help my tiny lizard brain get it. There are plenty of reasons to criticize the Penn State program. This? This is reaching.
The logic goes something like this: In high school, Larry Fitzgerald really wanted to attend Penn State but the PSU coaches turned him away because of grades. He went to Valley Forge Military Academy to get his academics in order and decided to go to Pitt. Then, the wheels begin to fall off the writer's strugglebus:
Nevertheless, it is difficult to argue that Fitzgerald would have been better off in Blue and White than in Blue and Gold. In 2002, Penn State's lefty QB Zach Mills wouldn't have provided the same deep ball arm as Panther southpaw Tyler Palko.
Actually, this is true, but mostly because Rod Rutherford was the Pitt starter in 2002 and 2003. Palko completed 2 of 3 passes in 2002 and redshirted in 2003, the year Fitzgerald finished 2nd in the Heisman voting and allowed him to subsequently bolt for the NFL. We can only assume that Palko would have thrown plenty of deep passes to Fitzgerald if they had been on the field together at any time during their Pitt careers. Who knows, maybe one of those two completions were thrown to Fitz. Dude catches everything, after all. Still, they must have been quite the connection on the practice field.
[Also, it's "Zack" Mills, which is nitpicking because 40% of Penn State fans still make that spelling mistake, but come on -- you work for a newspaper. One of the biggest newspapers that covers Penn State with regularity. Try a little harder.]
In addition, Pitt coach Walt Harris made the precocious freshman star the center of his offense. That wouldn't have happened at Penn State.
Totally. If there's anything we've learned about Joe Paterno, it's that he won't play freshmen if they're truly needed on the field.
That year the Lions floundering program was rekindled by another Larry, Larry Johnson, and his record 2,159 yards rushing. Despite his extraordinary talent, Johnson had to wait behind less talented upperclassmen and did not start until he was a senior.
At Pitt, Fitzgerald's talent made him No. 1 from day one. It's easy to say that a freshmen Fitzgerald wasn't going to turn Penn State into a pass-happy offense. Heck, he might not have even seen the field.
First of all, let's get one thing straight -- Larry Johnson didn't receive more playing time in 2001 because of Larry Johnson. He was a malcontent on a team with a few other pretty good running backs (Eric McCoo and Omar Easy). At some point, the little light bulb in his head lit up and he became the best running back in the country. A Voltron-ish receiver of Larry Fitzgerald duct taped to Cris Carter stapled to Jerry Rice -- let's call him Larcris Ricegerter -- wasn't going to turn Penn State into a pass-happy offense in 2002. We had this guy.
Nevermind the fact that Bryant Johnson was about to become a first-round draft pick and Tony Johnson was a year away from falling apart as a wide receiver. Still, I'm pretty sure that true freshman Larry Fitzgerald could have worked his way onto the field somehow. And if not, hey, he would've been redshirted in order to concentrate on his classes. I realize that's a cardinal sin in modern NCAA football, but it's how things are often done at Penn State. Kids who are academic risks are given time to adjust to their new surroundings.
What about next year? Would Fitzgerald have helped State's moribund 3-9 2003 season? Would he have been featured then? Odds are the answer is yes to both questions.
Odds are? Really? With Tony Johnson and Maurice Humphrey as our primary receivers in 2003? Of course the answer is "yes." Exactly what the hell is the point? That Joe Paterno could have buried Larry Fitzgerald behind Kinta Palmer and Terrance Phillips for four years in Happy Valley? Apparently, only the immortal Wlat could have known that Fitzgerald could have possibly made an immediate impact as a freshman or sophomore receiver. All praise Wlat!
The takeaway from the PennLive item, other than Walt Harris' genius? Penn State was Larry Fitzgerald's #1 choice, but because Joe Paterno decided not to bend the academic rules for an immensely talented high school player, Joe Paterno is at fault and Walt Harris is the good guy for putting the guy on the field as a true freshman.
Also, when a writer wakes up and says "I'm going to use Larry Fitzgerald's success to zing Joe Paterno and Penn State for no obvious reason!", basic logic and minimal research are not requirements for publication.
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A quick summary:
“Larry Fitzgerald is a good receiver.
Joe Paterno has a reputation for benching freshmen.
I have to write 15 more inches to satisfy my contract, so here goes…”
It’s been said before on BSD, but it always bears repeating- ‘…and the newspapers all blame their failure on the interweb’.
There is a tractor in the parking lot, West Virginia license EIEIO. Your lights are on.
By the way...
Where is Walt Harris now? Where is Joe Paterno now?
by dontcallmescooter on Jan 26, 2009 12:55 PM EST reply actions
Back in the Pgh area
http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/08272/915585-87.stm
--
Mr. Bob Dobalina
by Run Up The Score on Jan 26, 2009 1:41 PM EST up reply actions
Although I realize your question was not, uh, serious.
Still, he’s hanging around the Pittsburgh region for some odd reason.
--
Mr. Bob Dobalina
by Run Up The Score on Jan 26, 2009 1:41 PM EST up reply actions
I've always liked Fitzgerald...
He always carries himself well. It would have been awesome to have had him at PSU and lay claim to an upstanding citizen.
RUTS – while PennLive.com is the online source for The Harrisburg Patriot and and few other area newspapers, not all of the content comes from these periodicals. It appears that the writer of this piece works for PennLive.com, not any of the newspapers – he’s “just a lowly” blogger. If he continues to re-write history to enforce his arguments, he may have a future at the newly-Mexican owne NY Times.
pinkertonpark.com - you owe yerself a laugh.
Yes, PennLive.com...
…also includes news from the Lehigh Valley newspapers and a few others.
I believe our writer in question spends a lot of time on Pitt and Pittsburgh sports issues, which may help explain his motives.
--
Mr. Bob Dobalina
by Run Up The Score on Jan 26, 2009 1:43 PM EST up reply actions
I can't wait for the 2014 article...
…where they replace the words “Larry Fitzgerald” with “LeSean McCoy” and focus on 2006 & 2007. It will be equally as ridiculous.
Let's see...
I can’t wait to see them mention how McCoy failed to help his team score any points in Pitt’s first bowl game in 20 years, and lose a game 3-0.
This is what is wrong with BSD and blogs in general
You are holding a writer (who gets paid to do such) accountable. Back in the good old days we would all have to be happy reading the paper, nodding and deciding Joepa really is a scoundrel. Sure you could have written a letter to the editor, which most likely would have been forwarded to the trash can. So thanks lowly blogger.
We just needed a couple players, a couple people to buy in to the fact and we were able to do it. --A.Q. Shipley
by psu on Jan 26, 2009 1:05 PM EST reply actions 2 recs
There is nothing wrong with BSD!!!
Shame, shame.
"The sea was angry that day, my friends." G. Costanza
This reminds me
of when JoePa apparently turned down Archie Manning’s request for his boys to attend PSU. http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9A05E1DC143EF93AA1575BC0A9629C8B63&sec=&spon=&pagewanted=4
When Archie Manning, the former N.F.L. quarterback, pleaded with Paterno to recruit his son Peyton, Paterno declined. When Manning pleaded with Paterno to recruit another son, Eli, a few years later, Paterno again declined. Peyton went to Tennessee and is now a superstar in the N.F.L.; Eli went to Mississippi and was selected by the New York Giants as the first pick in this year’s draft. Paterno explained his reason for not recruiting either of the Mannings to a Penn State magazine: ‘’I didn’t want to waste my time. I knew they’d play in the South.’’
Though of course those weren’t “academic” reasons. But imagine Eli passing to Fitzgerald (or Peyton!). I doubt we would have had quite as dark a period. Of course Paterno makes a good point that they probably wouldn’t have come anyway (Archie was probably just trying to raise national interest in them)
oh, and by the way, I don't like Eli
I think he is a whiney baby who can’t throw in the wind (thank god!). He may be talented, but I find guys like him (and Elway) who hold a team hostage, and basically say “no, if you draft me, I won’t play for you” to be guys I probably wouldn’t want on my team. I was glad to see San Diego actually become good after he snubbed them, too.
I’m just going off the hope that had he actually come to PSU (and not suffered the tutelage of Jay) that he might have still been quite good, and also had a good attitude.
by The JuggerNitt on Jan 26, 2009 1:26 PM EST up reply actions
I never heard that before
Everything ESPN has told me about the Mannings is that they’re a big time southern family. Also didn’t Archie play for Ole Miss? Obviously it would have been nice to have them, but it just sounds impossible to me.
Total pipe dream.
--
Mr. Bob Dobalina
by Run Up The Score on Jan 26, 2009 1:47 PM EST up reply actions
By the way.
Check out the glorious Wikipedia article for the 2003 Pitt football season.
Apparently they played 2 games, lost to Toledo, and then called it quits. That’s fan dedication right there.
Copy/Paste from CF reference
is a tall task; like these newspaper reporters I don’t know if it’s fair to hold Pitt fans with interweb access up to such high standards.
If you’re interested, the days of good old fashion wiki pranks may be coming to an end.
BSD
Fitzgerald was drafted by the Cowboys?
That’s news to me. Thanks wikipedia.
Zug be with you.
And also with you.
The bottom line is this: Coaches make mistakes all the time, especially in recruiting. It’s a messy business and the only people who know how things really went down are the people involved. You can sit on your high horse all day and second guess Paterno’s methods — and often you’d probably find some legitimate criticisms… But right now it’s 2009 and we’re recruiting well. We are coming off another successful season and have high hopes for the next. This article in PennLive is pointless and worse — poorly written.
"We hugged as grown men do. It was a great moment. Then, it was business as usual." -- LJ Sr.
OTL
And if Paterno had taken on Fitzgerald, he would have been used in the ESPN OTL piece as an example of how Paterno compromised his standards to win on the field.
This article is basically a complaint that Paterno didn’t do what ESPN accused him of doing.
"I want to eat some dessert." - Brandon Ware
by The Man with One Black Shoe on Jan 26, 2009 1:17 PM EST reply actions
I hadn't even considered the ESPN angle.
Although I believe the issue with ESPN is that they alleged we were taking guys with behavioral issues, not strictly academic issues. Feel free to correct me if I’m wrong.
--
Mr. Bob Dobalina
by Run Up The Score on Jan 26, 2009 1:45 PM EST up reply actions
Not wrong...
But I don’t think they based OTL on the fact we were deliberatley taking kids with behavioral issues and compromising our standards.
The gist was – we were compromising our standards for better-talent, even though we knew (allegedly) they were not the normal standard for a Penn State student athlete. Whether it was poor grades, personality, etc. However, JoePa understands these kids are KIDS – and I don’t think he judges them to much on personality at that age. I mean how do you know a kid is going to pull a knife on someone -ahem. I think coaches recruit kids with talent period – but I could be wrong.
I agree – we should send the story to OTL and ask them why we didn’t recruit LF against our standards. Oh – right, cause he didn’t have personality issues. (Except for the supposed smacking his wife thing)
?
I was also staring curiously at the content of the article, I even forwarded it to a Pitt alumni and “aquaintance”, we know they aren’t really friends…Anyway, what is the purpose of the story? Is it to tip off Penn State fans on Joe’s high standards of recruiting players, or that he should make exceptions if the player, 5 years down the road, is a total FREAK in the NFL? (Didn’t ESPN have an orgasm over this?)
It just seems like another quick stab in the back towards the local powerhouse football program. A program and a coach who has outlasted dozens of “writers” and continues to win, and win often. I’m still confused…
woo wooooooooo.
--
Mr. Bob Dobalina
by Run Up The Score on Jan 26, 2009 1:41 PM EST up reply actions
actually
JoePa chased him down after running that stop sign and verbally berated them.
by The JuggerNitt on Jan 26, 2009 1:46 PM EST up reply actions
I finally gave in and googled that image to see what the video was all about after months of seeing it on the internet. It did not disappoint. My favorite part was when he sped off and ran a stop sign while driving in the left-hand lane.
"We hugged as grown men do. It was a great moment. Then, it was business as usual." -- LJ Sr.
he only comitted said crimes
because, you know, it’s only early in the morning, and you’re supposed to be up cooking breakfast for somebody, and it’s like an alarm clock:
WOO-WOOOOOOOOOOO
World F#$king Champions
I didn't remember
them running the hell out of a stop sign and almost killed somebody during the “show it off” segment of the news program.
It’s too good to be real, but it is. And it’s all brought to us by the miracle that is local network news.
BSD
That clip is just utter amazement
You can find something new and hilarious almost every time you watch it. Eventually, even seeing how straight faced the news crew is when presenting this “news” becomes hilarious.
by The JuggerNitt on Jan 26, 2009 5:02 PM EST up reply actions
It’s a leprechaun flute
"They haven't played us yet."
by ReadingRambler on Jan 26, 2009 5:21 PM EST up reply actions
Bubb Rubb and Lil Sis soundboard
Now you can call people and have some fun with them. it’s that WOoooo WOOOOOOOo
PSU Softball
His Great Grandfather
Lived thousands of years ago.
Must be some clean living in that family…
There is a tractor in the parking lot, West Virginia license EIEIO. Your lights are on.
by leeharvey418 on Jan 27, 2009 5:27 AM EST up reply actions
Any way to get this "woo wooooooo" miked into the siren next time we get a recruit?
Woo wooooooooooo
"The sea was angry that day, my friends." G. Costanza
I usually don't read the reader comments at the end of an on-line article
(it’s much better for my blood presuure), but this one still has me laughing: “I can’t believe someone actually wrote an article trying to pretend what would have happened if someone else went to another school WOW. Why stop at Larry Fitzgerald? What if Reggie Bush went to Penn State? No no…what if Barry Sanders went to Penn State OMG!?!? What if [insert name of college star here] went to any other freakin’ school? Hey…what if Joe Montana could’ve built a time machine, gone into the future, transferred to PSU, and joined Fitz at Penn State?”
"The sea was angry that day, my friends." G. Costanza
wow....what if....
do you think we can still make it happen? I mean especially if Montana has that time machine…
by The JuggerNitt on Jan 26, 2009 1:47 PM EST up reply actions
How do we know...
that it didn’t already happen?
Notre Dame just beat us to it…
There is a tractor in the parking lot, West Virginia license EIEIO. Your lights are on.
by leeharvey418 on Jan 26, 2009 1:52 PM EST up reply actions
This stuff is priceless
“1943: With the boys fighting World War II overseas, the women of Notre Dame take the reins of the football team and pummel the notorious draft-dodging Michigan Wolverines to bring home another national title to South Bend.”
"The sea was angry that day, my friends." G. Costanza
that's one of my favorite Onion articles of all time
I remember some friends bringing me the hardcopy versions…it might even have been while tailgating before one of the ND games a couple years ago
by The JuggerNitt on Jan 26, 2009 10:48 PM EST up reply actions
I wonder
How much of those NYT and Star-Tribune articles he actually read? And I like how he slips in that jab about how Larry’s mom was struggling with cancer. Yes, JoePa is evil and hates people with cancer.
BSD vs. PennLive rivlary brewing?
I smell it, though I definitely do NOT want to see their talkbackers on this board, the “HJs” and the “SJs” …and the whole bit…
Playing devil’s advocate here: The spirit of this “article” is that Fitzgerald’s a PennState fan and the grades dropped when his mother was diagnosed with cancer, which seemed like an injustice I guess when JoePa put the clamps on him. And even if he were accepted, he wouldn’t have played his freshman year.
Yeah, who cares?
Why don’t we talk about a real Nittany Lion like Kerry Collins, who will start next year after a great regular season? Proof positive – for now – that performance trumps phenom superstardom.
I actually like most of the HPN / PennLive football stuff.
And I remain a HUGE fan of the commenters on that site, especially when it comes to political stories. An article about fighting at Chuck E. Cheese turns into a “WHY SHOULD I HAVE TO PRESS 1 FOR ENGLISH?” crapfest within about two hours. If you’re looking for the absolute best in racism and paranoia, the PennLive forums do NOT disappoint.
The football forums, of course, are total garbage. I like Jones and Flounders quite a bit.
--
Mr. Bob Dobalina
by Run Up The Score on Jan 26, 2009 3:00 PM EST up reply actions
Why indeed, though
but I suppose they don’t have to press 1 for english, they can always “toque dos para espanol”
by The JuggerNitt on Jan 26, 2009 3:06 PM EST up reply actions
Political Correctness comes to your automated phone tree.
I can never remember calling some sort of automated phone system and having to press one for English. Never. I’m sure I have, but it takes what, one or two seconds to get past that stage of the phone tree? How sad is someone’s life if this bothers them? Is this a product of laziness or xenophobia?
Shit, I’m just grateful I don’t have to push 7 or 8 for English. That would be annoying and unamerican.
--
Mr. Bob Dobalina
by Run Up The Score on Jan 26, 2009 3:38 PM EST up reply actions
Heaven forbid
we ever get to the point where us lazy Americans have to learn a second language. Then it’s a slippery slope until we’re just like Europe where everyone knows three, four, or five languages.
Mike
Black Shoe Diaries
I'm doing my part
And can now swear in Romanian, thanks to my soon-to-be bride.
Random aside — You know what’s funny about her off-the-boat Romanian parents? They hate immigrants. If they could’ve slammed the door behind them as they walked into the country, they totally would’ve done it. But it’s cute that they go to other countries and vehemently tell everyone they’re Americans (which they are, but they accents are still quite thick).
--
Mr. Bob Dobalina
by Run Up The Score on Jan 26, 2009 4:42 PM EST up reply actions
Soon to be Romanian brides sound HOT!
We just needed a couple players, a couple people to buy in to the fact and we were able to do it. --A.Q. Shipley
indeed!
and doesn’t someone here have a Hungarian wife?
Eastern European women = HOT!
by The JuggerNitt on Jan 26, 2009 10:48 PM EST up reply actions
but unfortunately hairy
We just needed a couple players, a couple people to buy in to the fact and we were able to do it. --A.Q. Shipley
Dude...
I don’t think that’s hair.
There is a tractor in the parking lot, West Virginia license EIEIO. Your lights are on.
by leeharvey418 on Jan 27, 2009 4:11 PM EST up reply actions
Hey, I "know" Russian and Spanish
in that I probably couldn’t hold a conversation anymore, but once I could at least talk about the weather ;-)
by The JuggerNitt on Jan 26, 2009 5:04 PM EST up reply actions
David Jones is actually pretty accurate...for a Buckeye
Flounders and Horvath are okay too.
Oh yeah, Obama won because of Affirmative Action, and his Socialist policies will make way for an American Gestapo, putting us away in Gulags forever…so says Ann Coulter, our Queen. Go Penn State!
by Mr. Rosewater on Jan 26, 2009 3:27 PM EST up reply actions
Strugglebus
Totally off point, but I love how this term has become a staple of the BSD vernacular ever since the women’s volleyball match againt Nebraska.
Phil
Or...
…BSD could buy a retired PSU team bus, retool it as the “BSD Strugglebus,” and take BSD on the road to all the PSU games? Would save all of us from trying to figure out where to tailgate. :)
So how many BSD t-shirts do we need to buy to make this happen?
Phil
This is the greatest idea since the idea of ideas was ideated
John Madden told me 90% of the game was half-mental...
by TheK-GunNeedsReloaded on Jan 27, 2009 6:18 PM EST up reply actions
Spec-frickin'-tacular!
Whoever did this, we all owe him a beer.
There is a tractor in the parking lot, West Virginia license EIEIO. Your lights are on.
at first I thought it was a joke
like the altered wikipedia entries.
But nope, it is a real word.
by The JuggerNitt on Jan 26, 2009 5:07 PM EST up reply actions
Am I the only one...
…who doesn’t understand the “Wlat Harris” misspelling thing? If so, sorry, but could someone please explain this to me?
"We heard all that talk all week about the SEC and their speed, but we knew personally that they weren't nearly as tough as us."
-Tony Hunt
Me too
"They haven't played us yet."
by ReadingRambler on Jan 26, 2009 11:01 PM EST up reply actions
Dogpile on the Rabbit!
I’m officially putting my name in as wanting to know, too.
There is a tractor in the parking lot, West Virginia license EIEIO. Your lights are on.
by leeharvey418 on Jan 27, 2009 6:57 AM EST up reply actions
Ours is not to wonder why.
I can only assume it was a typo that stuck somehow.
--
Mr. Bob Dobalina
by Run Up The Score on Jan 27, 2009 9:08 AM EST up reply actions
Because if it was spelled correctly
then it would be perfect.
Think about it.
by Mr. Rosewater on Jan 27, 2009 2:27 PM EST up reply actions
What if C-A-T...
Really spelled ‘dog’?
There is a tractor in the parking lot, West Virginia license EIEIO. Your lights are on.
by leeharvey418 on Jan 27, 2009 2:50 PM EST up reply actions
then man's best friend
would be a pussy…dog
by The JuggerNitt on Jan 27, 2009 3:55 PM EST up reply actions
Gotta think of something to write about
Here is a thought, has there ever been a hot prospect that Pitt rejected and came to PSU that went on to star in the NFL? I dunno, but if there was I want to write an article about how Wannstache or whatever coach screwed up.
He was the first to come to mind for me
but then I remembered that a) he turned them down, and b) he didn’t even go on to star in the NCAA, let alone the NFL…yet….bwahahahahahaha I couldn’t get that “yet” out with a straight face)
by The JuggerNitt on Jan 28, 2009 12:25 PM EST up reply actions
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