Monday Questions, or "Let's Rationalize A Possible BCS Bid"
by KevinHD on Nov 16, 2009 9:00 AM EST
in Football
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PrintIf we're eligible, does it really matter who's ranked ahead of us?
Of course not. Iowa is ranked #13, Penn State is ranked #14, all of it is irrelevant. The BCS has two functions: to try and pick the two most deserving teams that will be allowed a shot at their crystal ball, and making money off of everyone else.
The best way to make money is not to pick the next best 10 teams, but to pick the teams with the best following who the general public believes will compete with their pairing. Remember none of these games matter anyway: nothing can be won or lost in any game that isn't the BCS MNC. It's always fun to win on a big stage, but the games are not a means to some kind of end.
So, if you want to be a purist about it, you have to pick the team with a bigger following and better TV ratings.
(It's worth noting that Iowa has a strong fan base and even buy their tickets. The point isn't one that tears down the Hawkeyes, but it's hard to defend the idea that Iowa will somehow make a bowl more money than Penn State if both teams finish with two losses.)
Let's get ethical: does Penn State even deserve a shot?
There are two standards here: one is the respect and aura we've built around the term "BCS team." Based on our performance against Iowa and Ohio State, I would probably agree with you in saying this team is not a typical BCS powerhouse.
But this is not a typical year. Outside of the top three to five teams, no one is doing anything.
So the real question is this: is Penn State one of the top 12 teams after you take into account the two-team-per rule?
It depends. Penn State lacks a quality win outside of Temple (other receiving votes woo wooo), but: (1) they also haven't lost to North Carolina State (2) he team has zero close calls against mid-majors and (3) their losses are to top 15 teams.
All three of those things are not true about Wisconsin, Iowa, Virginia Tech, Boise State and Pitt.
Penn State's best asset is that they don't currently have any stupid losses. I know that doesn't seem like much, but it's a strange year.
You don't have to be proud of it or pretend this is some kind of legendary effort, but the landscape is important.
Here is the real question: can we get picked ahead of Iowa?
And really there is no legit answer for this. Iowa has now lost their last two games. Stanzi is out and will likely be rusty at best in a bowl game. They lost to jNW, which should always be noted.
But they beat Penn State.
So what do you do?
Couldn't this all be a worthless and borderline embarrassing discussion?
You bet. Penn State is just a 3.5 point favorite against Michigan State this weekend. Iowa and Ohio State appear to be in much more comfortable games (favored by 9.5 and 12.5, respectively). This weekend is no sure thing.
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Conversating with Hawkeyes this weekend
They clearly don’t understand how the BCS works still. Their main argument was…….but we have the same record and beat you head to head this year so there’s no way PSU will get the at-large bid over Iowa.
Their minds may not be complex enough
to understand the intricacies of the BCS selection process, but they can shuck one hell of an ear of corn.
Just like how MIssouri beat Kansas so they got the BCS bid the other year
Wait….no….
Black Shoes. Basic Blues. No Name. All Game.
"Everyone has a plan, until they get punched in the mouth."
Very well thought out article
+1 for the info, and i wish I could +1 for irrelevant also.
Deus nobiscum, quis contra?
BCS Game
I would love to see PSU in a BCS game. Not sure there is much to be gained by playing Boise State. All the pundits say Iowa or PSU would play Boise State in a BCS game.
Would we be better off playing an SEC opponent in the Capitol One Bowl?
I could be drinking the Blue and White Kool Aid but I think the Joe Pa appeal and TV ratings the BCS takes PSU over Iowa and Wis. Besides the Champ. game the BCS is faced with many games without National appeal and TV readings.
I would love to see PSU in a BCS game. Not sure there is much to be gained by playing Boise State. All the pundits say Iowa or PSU would play Boise State in a BCS game.
What pundits? I would imagine it’s either Fiesta versus TCU (unless the “pundits” are predicting a TCU loss and Boise St getting the auto bid from non-BCS conferences) or Orange versus the ACC champ.
with the USC loss a lot of "experts" are now predicting both Boise and TCU to get a bid.
And it would still leave one for an extra b10, according to their predictions. At least that is what I have seen a lot of today/yesterday.
by PSUinBOSSton on Nov 16, 2009 11:28 AM EST up reply actions
I don’t buy it. I think we’ll see Oklahoma St or Virginia Tech sneak into the top 14 and get a bid over the BCS games willingly inviting Boise St.
I don't see Ok St winning out and ending up that high.
You’re also giving Va Tech a lot more credit than they deserve. I don’t know about their BCS appearances, but I do know they can’t get anyone to go to the ACC championship games. Are they so much of an improvement over Boise? Nationally, Boise is more compelling than 3 loss Va Tech.
by PSUinBOSSton on Nov 16, 2009 11:40 AM EST up reply actions
Va Tech travels pretty well and is a known quantity. If they make the top 14 of the BCS (I think they are 15 right now), I feel secure that they’d be chosen for an at large spot over Boise St or the Pitt/Cinci loser.
The only thing though is if the Fiesta chooses a Big Ten team to replace Texas, then the Orange won’t be able to choose Va Tech (since they will already have the ACC champ in their other spot). In that case, I’d be curious to see what happens — they’d probably take Oklahoma St if available or they might take TCU and end up with the Fiesta being PSU or Iowa versus Va Tech.
"Va Tech travels pretty well."
Is that true? I’m not trying to be a jackass here, but I honestly don’t know. I do know that they could barely get over 50% attendance for the last 2 ACC championship games they were in.
by PSUinBOSSton on Nov 16, 2009 12:28 PM EST up reply actions
Va Tech
They have that rep of travelling well, to the extent that when bowls are looking at ACC teams, Va Tech and Clemson are always mentioned at the top of the list of who bowl games want. I don’t know if the ACC championships are a great counter example given that (1) they are relatively short notice, (2) Va Tech isn’t all that close to Florida and probably doesn’t have a ton of alumni there so most fans would have to make special arrangements to go, (3) fans might simply choose to go to the bowl game instead, (4) they’ve been to the championship now 3 out of 4 years.
Also, don’t discount that the last two ACC championships were against BC, which has a rep for not having a fan base or travelling at all. also, last season Va Tech was pretty mediocre — the attendence in 2007 wasn’t that bad (53,000) but I think Hokie fans just weren’t that motivated to go to yet another championship game, against Boston College again, for an 8-4 team that would also have a bowl game.
I could be wrong.
I think you just hit the nail on the head
basically the ACC championship game hasn’t really been a good matchup and you can practically guarantee who the winner will be. And if you have the $ to travel to one big game, what would you rather do, go to the ACC championship game against a mediocre opponent, or go to a bowl game?
by The JuggerNitt on Nov 16, 2009 12:54 PM EST up reply actions
plus.. they've been held in Jacksonville the last few years
and the weather in jax in dec is usually a mixed bag of meh at best.
All that is fine.
I wasn’t suggesting it as a counter, merely that it was the only example I could think of, and that the attendance in games they have been involved in (although they’ve been involved in almost all of them) has been cited as a reason that game has been a revenue generating failure.
However, simply poking holes in my example and making excuses isn’t exactly robust empirical evidence that they travel well. I am not saying you are wrong whatsoever, and maybe I’m just the most skeptical person in the world, but calling them the second most appealing team in the ACC doesn’t necessarily make them appealing enough to be a sure thing over Boise. I’m not convinced that saying Boise will be “willingly” selected is so outrageous.
by PSUinBOSSton on Nov 16, 2009 12:55 PM EST up reply actions
Well, Va Tech draws over 65,000 per home game while Boise St draws a little over 30,000 to their home games, so that’s at least one point that favors Va Tech’s fan base. Also, Boise St is a relatively small school for 1-A and Idaho is a relatively sparsely populated state, compared to Va Tech and Virginia.
I don’t think I could point to any hard data off-hand that would support the idea that Va Tech would be a significantly larger draw than Boise St, but I feel that’s the case.
And it's probably true.
I’m just saying, I’d be interested to see what the bowl attendance figures are like. For all I know, all 30,000 people that go to Boise home games went to the last BCS game, and Va Tech only averages 10,000. The point is, I just don’t know enough to assume one way or the other.
by PSUinBOSSton on Nov 16, 2009 1:07 PM EST up reply actions
merely that it was the only example I could think of, and that the attendance in games they have been involved in (although they’ve been involved in almost all of them) has been cited as a reason that game has been a revenue generating failure.
Oh, and I haven’t really herd this at all. It’s always been Boston College who is cited as the problem with the ACC Championship game attendance, not Va Tech. I mean, the inaugural game which involved Va Tech did draw 72,000 (though, admittedly, facing off against FSU in Florida probably helped attendance as well).
Perhaps that was unclear.
The point was, poor attendance at that game overall has been cited as the game being a failure, since it was really a revenue generating instrument. And I was admitting that although Va Tech could be linked to that game with so many instances of poor attendance, it’s more because they always play in it and so would be difficult to credit them directly.
by PSUinBOSSton on Nov 16, 2009 1:11 PM EST up reply actions
if they really have it set up as a revenue generating instrument
then perhaps they should find a way to make it a home game for one of the teams (perhaps the one with better overall record, and/or BCS ranking). They’d probably be able to sell a lot more tickets that way.
by The JuggerNitt on Nov 16, 2009 1:37 PM EST up reply actions
I would be interested in seeing the average travel difference
fanbases would need to travel to the SEC, b12, and ACC title games. Or average distance between the schools themselves, maybe average distance from the center point, however it could best be shown. On the one hand, the ACC may be the most spread out. On the other, I would think you are closer to an airport in ACC city than b12 city in most cases.
The game goes out to bid I thought. I know it is in a stint in Tampa, then will be in Charlotte for a few years.
by PSUinBOSSton on Nov 16, 2009 1:45 PM EST up reply actions
Championship games...
I believe the SEC game is always in Atlanta, which probably has the largest concentration of SEC alums in the south. I believe most B12 games have been in St. Louis, which likely has a large B12 alumni base. For the ACC, I don’t think Jacksonville has that large of an ACC alumni base outside of FSU or Miami grads. Atlanta would make the most since, IMO, for the ACC game, but the SEC is already there.
Never mistake effort for achievement.
by Esteban d' Amur on Nov 16, 2009 2:20 PM EST up reply actions
ATLANTIC COAST Conference
They should have it in Savannah or Myrtle Beach or Wilmington.
DO YOU HAVE PRIDE, DANNY?
by ReadingRambler on Nov 16, 2009 2:32 PM EST up reply actions
How about...
Milton, DE?
Never mistake effort for achievement.
by Esteban d' Amur on Nov 16, 2009 2:36 PM EST up reply actions
Camp Lejeune?
DO YOU HAVE PRIDE, DANNY?
by ReadingRambler on Nov 16, 2009 2:41 PM EST up reply actions
ACC Championship game
They’re moving it to Charlotte, NC next year because Virginia Tech has been complaining forever about having to travel to Florida every year for it.
Which I think is funny because now for the next 4 years, Miami will probably be playing in the game.
Luring recruits with my new "Posting HD" scheme since '08.
Actually,
I’m pretty sure that Jacksonville, Tampa (where it is now) and Charlotte all signed deals before even the first game. Either way, they go out to bid and the cities prepare bid packages based on perceived boost to local economies. Charlotte put in a huge bid because they were building a new field at the time. Va Tech bitching wasn’t a factor.
by PSUinBOSSton on Nov 16, 2009 6:48 PM EST up reply actions
MAN
Everyone is calling me on my half-assed BS responses in this thread.
Luring recruits with my new "Posting HD" scheme since '08.
This is a little weak
Your responses have been rather full-assed.
"For me the game wasn’t grounded in reality. It was about the uniform you put on that turned you into a warrior. It was about the mythology of the battle, the victory, the defeat, the struggle." - Mike Reid, PSU '69
Jacksonville was only for a few years.
They wouldn’t go back there for a while.
by PSUinBOSSton on Nov 16, 2009 6:46 PM EST up reply actions
Its all about who travels best and amount of people who will watch on TV
The BCS is about getting top 2 teams…thats it
HAHS circa 93' "Football is 1/2 Offense, 1/2 Defense, and 1/2 Special teams".
No shame in a BCS bowl...
The name of the game is $$$$. Nothing wrong with PSU reaping the benefit of its history and large alumni and non-alumni following, which translates into butts in the seats and ratings on T.V.
Never mistake effort for achievement.
by Esteban d' Amur on Nov 16, 2009 9:31 AM EST reply actions
Eh, I think there is something wrong though.
I think the best teams should play. Not saying it’s PSU’s problem or that we’re at fault for having more fans than most, but the system is shameful IMO.
If we get picked over an undefeated Boise State, or a 5th-ranked anybody…I’m gonna have a hard time claiming we earned a BCS bid.
The non-MNC games...
are about $. Boise doesn’t draw like PSU. I’m not saying it doesn’t stink, but that’s how the game is played.
Never mistake effort for achievement.
by Esteban d' Amur on Nov 16, 2009 10:59 AM EST up reply actions
"earned" the bid
I think the problem is the association you make in your mind with the BCS. The point is to find the top 2 teams, and spread that game around a few select locations. Otherwise, they’re just bowl games like the rest. If we are mathematically eligible, then we can be picked. Would you feel the same way if we were talking about who gets the cap one vs. outback I wonder?
by PSUinBOSSton on Nov 16, 2009 11:00 AM EST up reply actions
Trivia question of the morning:
Other than PSU, what are the only other two big ten programs with all-time winning bowl records?
Deus nobiscum, quis contra?
Michigan's one
DO YOU HAVE PRIDE, DANNY?
by ReadingRambler on Nov 16, 2009 9:42 AM EST up reply actions
MIchigan is 19-20-0
Deus nobiscum, quis contra?
by chocochuck02 on Nov 16, 2009 9:44 AM EST up reply actions
Oh!
Then I’m out of guesses
DO YOU HAVE PRIDE, DANNY?
by ReadingRambler on Nov 16, 2009 9:44 AM EST up reply actions
He said Big Ten programs
DO YOU HAVE PRIDE, DANNY?
by ReadingRambler on Nov 16, 2009 9:43 AM EST up reply actions
I wouldn't say that
in this cesspool of lawyers we call the BSD comments section
by The JuggerNitt on Nov 16, 2009 12:55 PM EST up reply actions
Congrats
You just acquired a Hyundai and a pitiful wardrobe.
Being a Penn State engineer doesn’t exactly pay.
Luring recruits with my new "Posting HD" scheme since '08.
Hey, I'm about to graduate with a PSU engineering degree
Don’t say those things. Let me dream.
Black Shoes. Basic Blues. No Name. All Game.
"Everyone has a plan, until they get punched in the mouth."
USC is 31-16
But, yeah, they’re kinda not in the Big Ten.
Deus nobiscum, quis contra?
by chocochuck02 on Nov 16, 2009 9:45 AM EST up reply actions
They also get the benefit of the doubt
by having an ancient home bowl game tie in with a conference that only has 3 teams over .500 in bowl games.
Deus nobiscum, quis contra?
by chocochuck02 on Nov 16, 2009 9:48 AM EST up reply actions
Who built those bridges in Hawaii?
Of course I'm home. I'm always home. I'm uncool.
by WestPointLion on Nov 16, 2009 10:48 AM EST up reply actions
Penn State Engineers
"For me the game wasn’t grounded in reality. It was about the uniform you put on that turned you into a warrior. It was about the mythology of the battle, the victory, the defeat, the struggle." - Mike Reid, PSU '69
by jtothep on Nov 16, 2009 1:58 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
Hopefully PSU engineers didn't design this bridge in London
Perfection is not attainable, but if we chase perfection we can catch excellence.
Vince Lombardi
Shoot,
I worked hard to get that photo to load, finally got the image to load. It worked in the preview but now doesn’t show up. ???
Perfection is not attainable, but if we chase perfection we can catch excellence.
Vince Lombardi
It worked last night...possibly taken down by photobucket
for questionable material?
"Every player we have, someone—maybe a parent, a grandparent, someone—poured their life and soul into that young man. They are handing that young man off to us. They are giving us their treasure, and it's our job to make sure we give them back that young man intact and ready to face the world." - Joe Paterno
by Horse N Buggy on Nov 17, 2009 10:13 AM EST up reply actions
Somewhat misleading, though
Only Florida has more than two games you might watch if your favorite team isn’t in it (unless you’re desperate for some football to watch, anyway).
Wait
there’s a bowl game in Canada? Or did we finally decide to give Michigan and the Motor City Bowl back to the Mounties?
by dawsonPSU10 on Nov 16, 2009 10:25 AM EST up reply actions
Irrelevant
Its the RCMP Bowl now.
Deus nobiscum, quis contra?
by chocochuck02 on Nov 16, 2009 10:26 AM EST up reply actions
the International Bowl
which last I checked is the likely destination for Temple
by The JuggerNitt on Nov 16, 2009 12:59 PM EST up reply actions
Iowa is right 12-10-1
Deus nobiscum, quis contra?
by chocochuck02 on Nov 16, 2009 9:47 AM EST up reply actions
If the Badgers win this year, they'll be 11-10
DO YOU HAVE PRIDE, DANNY?
by ReadingRambler on Nov 16, 2009 9:44 AM EST up reply actions
I'll just list all the schools, by winning percentage
Penn State – 26-13-2 (.667)
Iowa – 12-10-1 (.545)
Purdue – 8-7-0 (.533)
Wisconsin – 10-10-0 (.500)
Michigan – 19-20-0 (.487)
OH-IO! – 18-22-0 (.450)
Michigan State – 7-10-0 (.412)
Illinois – 6-9-0 (.400)
Minnesota – 5-8-0 (.385)
Indiana – 3-6-0 (.333)
jNW – 1-6-0 (.143)
Deus nobiscum, quis contra?
by chocochuck02 on Nov 16, 2009 10:08 AM EST up reply actions
Wisconsin and Iowa?
Black Shoes. Basic Blues. No Name. All Game.
"Everyone has a plan, until they get punched in the mouth."
The best thing for the B10's image would be to have only one BCS team
With only one BCS team, much more favorable matchups are created all the way down the line. The conference could end up doing what the PAC 10 did last year, which would really help the respect factor. Two B10 teams in the BCS creates media focus as well as unfavorable matchups all the way down to whatever the Motor City Bowl is called nowadays.
As a Penn State fan, I am hoping for a victory over MSU and an Iowa loss, sending us to CapOne vs. LSU.
It's my opinion that the media doesn't care about our lower tier bowl matchups
Maybe I’m wrong, but that’s the impression I have.
I think Wisconsin and Penn State would do well in Capital One and Outback. And Iowa could probably take Boise State.
DO YOU HAVE PRIDE, DANNY?
by ReadingRambler on Nov 16, 2009 9:46 AM EST up reply actions
They don't care about the game or remember who played
but they will certainly mention that your conference is 5-1 or 1-6 in bowl games.
I don't think this is right
you always see the empty “conference bowl record” stat thrown up without regard to what bowls anyone is playing in.
And if the media only cares about big games, the Big Ten should get a little credit for perennially putting 2 in the BCS.
In your scenario
I think we are a lock for a BCS bid.
by PSUinBOSSton on Nov 16, 2009 10:17 AM EST up reply actions
yeah, except we'd probably have a better chance of winning whatever BCS bowl game we get to
over LSU in the cap one bowl, and if you win 1 or both of your BCS games, they don’t quite care about the rest of the record. Unforunately last year the Big 10 lost both of it’s BCS bowls and then didn’t have any lesser bowl wins to help stop the bleeding.
by The JuggerNitt on Nov 16, 2009 1:09 PM EST up reply actions
I'm not sure
LSU hasn’t impressed me yet. And, again, I’ll keep posting this stat: they’re not exactly great at rushing the QB.
DO YOU HAVE PRIDE, DANNY?
by ReadingRambler on Nov 16, 2009 1:44 PM EST up reply actions
while that is true
none of our likely BCS opponents impress me either.
by The JuggerNitt on Nov 16, 2009 1:46 PM EST up reply actions
I really cannot stand the term "BCS Buster"
I glance at yahoo sports often. I think they have headlined the term in reference to about 9 different teams this year. This morning I see an article titled “Best BCS Buster Ever”.
Best BCS Buster Ever:
Temple.
DO YOU HAVE PRIDE, DANNY?
by ReadingRambler on Nov 16, 2009 9:53 AM EST up reply actions
23 votes in the AP 25 this week
If they hadn’t lost to ‘Nova, they’d be in the top 20 right now.
In general, MAC teams get no love. The conference should hire a PR firm and they should quit playing so many tough out-of-conference games.
If they played in the Big East
they’d be top 10 right now.
Deus nobiscum, quis contra?
by chocochuck02 on Nov 16, 2009 10:17 AM EST up reply actions
You're kidding, right?
They wouldn’t beat Cinci or Pitt or Rutgers or WVU or USF. It’s unlikely they’d beat UConn, except that UConn has been the anti-Iowa this year (losing five close games). If they played my Orange early in the year (when we weren’t killed by injuries, and Mike Williams hadn’t quite the team), they probably would have lost to us, too.
There's a reason the MAC gets no love
they have some of the worst teams in Div I-A football right now. If you looked at RPI in football, they’re dead last in conferences.
by Screen Name 20 on Nov 16, 2009 11:58 AM EST up reply actions
Actually, considering W. Kentucky is in the Sun Belt now
they probably take the cake for worst conference.
by Screen Name 20 on Nov 16, 2009 12:05 PM EST up reply actions
Yes
Penn State could be picked ahead of Iowa. Should they? Probably not, but should doesn’t matter. Just as it didn’t matter when Iowa was picked ahead of Northwestern, a team that beat Iowa and had a better record than Iowa.
Iowa/PSU is a close call. I suspect that if Iowa is ahead in the BCS Rankings (although that doesn’t actually require such a choice), that plus the head-to-head win will result in the Fiesta picking Iowa over Penn State. The fact that both teams have good traveling histories makes it a win/win decision for the Fiesta.
http://www.rivalryesq.com/
The quintessential Big Ten smoking room.
According to Mandel
The Fiesta Bowl wants Iowa, while the Orange Bowl prefers Penn State.
I think we’re going to get beat by Michigan State this week anyway, so it doesn’t really matter.
Land Grant or bust! Worst 10-2 team ever? Beat Michigan State.
I too think we're going to lose
What are the chances of the Capital One Bowl selecting us over a 10 win Wisconsin team?
DO YOU HAVE PRIDE, DANNY?
by ReadingRambler on Nov 16, 2009 10:47 AM EST up reply actions
Don't know
and I don’t really care, other than the fact that 11:00 is way too early for a football game to start.
But other than that, what’s the difference?
Land Grant or bust! Worst 10-2 team ever? Beat Michigan State.
The difference is that LSU will be ranked in the top 10
Compared to the soft middle teams in the SEC
DO YOU HAVE PRIDE, DANNY?
by ReadingRambler on Nov 16, 2009 10:50 AM EST up reply actions
11AM is Outback Bowl
1PM I think is Cap 1. Outback bowl is 10 minutes from my house but 11AM new years day still totally sucks ass. And 1 PM isn’t ideal either.
I got Steelers@ Dolphins tickets on 1/3 so Orange bowl would be nice.
"It was an attrition football game and you know we like that."
Sparty is no different than Temple, Northwestern, and Minny
They’re inconsistent, often beat themselves, and are barely good enough to get into a lower tier bowl game but not good enough to beat anyone of significance.
The Michigan State I see is one with a very solid front four, good receivers, Greg Jones and Kirk Cousins
Inconsistent? Sure as hell. But I won’t be confident until the game is over.
DO YOU HAVE PRIDE, DANNY?
by ReadingRambler on Nov 16, 2009 10:52 AM EST up reply actions
Oh no doubt we could blow this game
but expecting us to lose is another story IMO. We should expect to win this game if we show up with a pulse.
The MSU team you described is the same team we blew up last year and I expect to blow up again this year. Our leaders are Seniors and they’re not going out like punks on Saturday. I suspect we’ll be fine.
They looked perfectly willing to go out like punks Saturday.
Bowman bailed them out.
Land Grant or bust! Worst 10-2 team ever? Beat Michigan State.
I don't know
I was at the game this weekend, watching while the team showed up at the stadium. They looked really unenthused, and then played that way, and then Clark Tweeted about how badly he played. I don’t know if they’ll show up next weekend.
Sounds like last year
Big loss late in the year, slow/lethargic win over Indiana, end season with Michy State. I’m not making a prediction at this point, but I can’t deny I’ve heard this story before.
"In the beginning the Universe was created.
This has made a lot of people very angry and been widely regarded as a bad move."
That would be an ideal sendoff @ MSU
And kudos on picking up on the odd trend like last year
by dawsonPSU10 on Nov 17, 2009 12:38 AM EST up reply actions
I beg to differ on your "very solid front four"
well, I guess they are “solid”, but they’re not world beaters.
by The JuggerNitt on Nov 16, 2009 1:13 PM EST up reply actions
Psshaw
Next you’ll tell me they lost to Central Michigan, Notre Dame, and Minnesota/
Deus nobiscum, quis contra?
by chocochuck02 on Nov 16, 2009 10:53 AM EST up reply actions
But Sparty Didn't Beat Themselves...
…LAST time they had Penn St out there.
Plus for whatever it’s worth that sore losing prick w/ ears coach is DEFINATELY holding a grudge after last year when PSU had the audacity to throw a pss in the 4th Q.
Damn it would great to hang half a hundy on Dantonio just for the hell of it.
by JoePaMustStay on Nov 16, 2009 10:53 AM EST up reply actions
This team plays too entitled.
They don’t really “deserve” a BCS bid, and I suspect that they’ll play like it this weekend.
D’Antonio is for sure going to have his team set on kill, and as I’ve said many times in the past, things are always strange in East Lansing.
I think Michigan State is going to want it more. I really do.
Land Grant or bust! Worst 10-2 team ever? Beat Michigan State.
I went to east lansing in 2005
and the only thing that was strange was how loud the penn state section was.
We could lose any game, but I think you’re giving D’Antonio too much credit.
BSD
Yeah
Kind of a different team in 2005, no?
Land Grant or bust! Worst 10-2 team ever? Beat Michigan State.
Yeah
Kind of the same SPARTY NO!, no?
Deus nobiscum, quis contra?
by chocochuck02 on Nov 16, 2009 11:03 AM EST up reply actions
D'Antonio is consistent in the inconsistencies of his teams
They gave up 42 points to a Deckerless FIGHT!!! LOVE!!! TRY!!! SUCK!!!
Deus nobiscum, quis contra?
by chocochuck02 on Nov 16, 2009 11:12 AM EST up reply actions
Who picks first?
Twitter: @scrappled
"When it’s third-and-10, you can take the milk drinkers and I’ll take the whiskey drinkers every time" - Max McGee
by Run Up The Score on Nov 16, 2009 10:55 AM EST up reply actions
It depends
on whether or not the Fiesta Bowl loses Texas to the National Title game, I believe.
Land Grant or bust! Worst 10-2 team ever? Beat Michigan State.
Its:
1) Replacement for #1 Team
2) Replacement for #2 Team
3) Orange Bowl
4) Fiesta Bowl
5) Sugar Bowl
Deus nobiscum, quis contra?
by chocochuck02 on Nov 16, 2009 10:59 AM EST up reply actions
So
The question is who will the Fiesta Bowl take to replace Texas? TCU or Iowa?
I think Mandell’s full of shit, and that they’ll take Penn State over any of those teams. The Fiesta Bowl loves Penn State.
Land Grant or bust! Worst 10-2 team ever? Beat Michigan State.
WE WILL ALWAYS OWN TEMPE
Deus nobiscum, quis contra?
by chocochuck02 on Nov 16, 2009 11:06 AM EST up reply actions
too bad the game is in Glendale this year....
How could Nixon know so little about Watergate and so much about football ?
maybe we can own Glendale?
Deus nobiscum, quis contra?
by chocochuck02 on Nov 16, 2009 11:10 AM EST up reply actions
If Okie State...
wins out, The Fiesta will take them.
Never mistake effort for achievement.
by Esteban d' Amur on Nov 16, 2009 11:10 AM EST up reply actions
They're not winning out
DO YOU HAVE PRIDE, DANNY?
by ReadingRambler on Nov 16, 2009 11:15 AM EST up reply actions
That's why I said "If".., but I agree.
Never mistake effort for achievement.
by Esteban d' Amur on Nov 16, 2009 11:38 AM EST up reply actions
I'd make a "Come after me! I'm a man! I'm 40! I drive a Dodge Stratus!" joke here
But I did this morning, and I just can’t bear to do it again.
Deus nobiscum, quis contra?
by chocochuck02 on Nov 16, 2009 11:18 AM EST up reply actions
The question is who will the Fiesta Bowl take to replace Texas? TCU or Iowa?
Well, not TCU. I’m not certain that the Fiesta would take PSU over Iowa (though I still think they would) but I know they wouldn’t take TCU with their replament for Texas pick.
I also don’t see Oklahoma St being chosen over either Big Ten team.
Fiesta has a conference tie in with the Big 12...
that is why they would be chosen.
Never mistake effort for achievement.
by Esteban d' Amur on Nov 16, 2009 11:38 AM EST up reply actions
They have the option to take Oklahoma St if they wanted, but I don;t think the Fiesta would feel compelled to take a Big 12 team. They haven’t shown the same propensity to be linked to a conference as the Rose has (or the Sugar for that matter). Keep in mind that the Big 12/Fiesta tie-in is kind of new — previously, the Big 8 was tied to the Orange and the SWC to the Cotton.
True, but don't be surprised...
if Okie State is chosen if available.
Never mistake effort for achievement.
by Esteban d' Amur on Nov 16, 2009 12:50 PM EST up reply actions
FYI
The Fiesta Bowl officials attended the TCU/Utah game last Saturday.
by gumbercules on Nov 16, 2009 12:59 PM EST up reply actions
Thats deceptive
I heard Oregon was heading up their top 5.
Deus nobiscum, quis contra?
by chocochuck02 on Nov 16, 2009 1:01 PM EST up reply actions
If Oregon lost enough to get knocked out of the Rose
would they really still get a bid?
by PSUinBOSSton on Nov 16, 2009 1:02 PM EST up reply actions
I was making fun of every high school recruit ever.
Sorry.
Deus nobiscum, quis contra?
by chocochuck02 on Nov 16, 2009 1:04 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I forgot to factor in the unis, facilities, and Nike money I guess.
by PSUinBOSSton on Nov 16, 2009 1:08 PM EST up reply actions
They were wearing BLUE this weekend.
BLUE. When do we get to see the red, purple, orange, brown, mauve, eggshell, and invisible ones?
Black Shoes. Basic Blues. No Name. All Game.
"Everyone has a plan, until they get punched in the mouth."
Are you joking or color blind?
because those Oregon Unis were most definitely black
by whiteoutonly on Nov 16, 2009 3:08 PM EST up reply actions
Huh
Must have been the TV I was watching. Or the fact that I was watching at a bar. Or a combination.
Either way, Oregon’s uniforms are terrible.
Black Shoes. Basic Blues. No Name. All Game.
"Everyone has a plan, until they get punched in the mouth."
Irrelevant...
Officials from Fiesta, Rose and Orange were there
How could Nixon know so little about Watergate and so much about football ?
No idea where you're getting your info
Fiesta Bowl honchos John Junker and Alan Young came away as impressed with TCU off the field Saturday night as on it. Bowls want fans who will travel. “We came here to get a feel for a level of excitement,” Junker said after seeing 50,307 fill Amon Carter Stadium, breaking a 25-year-old attendance record by some 3,000. “It was a great atmosphere. That’s something we can feel.”
Bowl reps are...irrelevant.
They’re just flunkies who sell blocks of tickets and are rewarded with awful colored blazers and trips to late season football games.
Means nothing.
Twitter: @scrappled
"When it’s third-and-10, you can take the milk drinkers and I’ll take the whiskey drinkers every time" - Max McGee
by Run Up The Score on Nov 16, 2009 1:07 PM EST up reply actions
READING COMPREHENSION FAIL.
I thought these were the type of clowns who show up in Orange Bowl blazers, like I saw last year at the MSU game.
Twitter: @scrappled
"When it’s third-and-10, you can take the milk drinkers and I’ll take the whiskey drinkers every time" - Max McGee
by Run Up The Score on Nov 16, 2009 1:32 PM EST up reply actions
Fixed
Fiesta Bowl honchos John Junker and Alan Young came away as impressed with TCU off the field Saturday night as on it. Bowls want fans who will travel. "We came here to get a feel for a level of excitement because, I mean, why not fly out and get a free spot on the field for a game you can’t even watch on TV?" Junker said after seeing 50,307 fill Amon Carter Stadium, breaking a 25-year-old attendance record by some 3,000. "It was a great atmosphere, free, as in on the city’s dime. That’s something we can feel (that’s what she said)."
BSD
^THIS
I think bowl reps go to all the games of teams that are possible bowl selections. I wouldn’t get too crazy about them attending a game.
Deus nobiscum, quis contra?
by chocochuck02 on Nov 16, 2009 1:14 PM EST up reply actions
I watched the game and heard announcers and.....
With a record crowd of 50,307 — a sellout at 79-year-old Amon Carter Stadium without the benefit of an instate opponent — and representatives from the Orange, Rose and Fiesta bowls watching from the athletic director’s suite, the Frogs put on quite a show.
How could Nixon know so little about Watergate and so much about football ?
The URL
http://cbs11tv.com/local/Perfect.10.BCS.2.1313179.html
How could Nixon know so little about Watergate and so much about football ?
wow, that's some of the funkiest blockquote I've ever seen
even your sig got included
by The JuggerNitt on Nov 16, 2009 1:19 PM EST up reply actions
Yeah I really don't know how to exactly use the block quote
How could Nixon know so little about Watergate and so much about football ?
I didn't know that was possible
DO YOU HAVE PRIDE, DANNY?
by ReadingRambler on Nov 16, 2009 1:45 PM EST up reply actions
You know how I know you guys are nerds?
"For me the game wasn’t grounded in reality. It was about the uniform you put on that turned you into a warrior. It was about the mythology of the battle, the victory, the defeat, the struggle." - Mike Reid, PSU '69
Amazing fanbase
Amon G. Carter Stadium most recently sold out for the November 14th, 2009 TCU vs. Utah game. The previous sell-out came on September 16, 2006 when TCU defeated Texas Tech 12–3, and prior to that was on November 17, 1984, when the 12th-ranked TCU fell to 10th-ranked Texas in a regionally televised contest on ABC.
Deus nobiscum, quis contra?
by chocochuck02 on Nov 16, 2009 1:29 PM EST up reply actions
what, no love from the Fiesta bowl
don’t they know that without us, they’d be nothing? NOTHING!!!
by The JuggerNitt on Nov 16, 2009 1:12 PM EST up reply actions
Like Tina without Ike
Deus nobiscum, quis contra?
by chocochuck02 on Nov 16, 2009 1:16 PM EST up reply actions
The more I think about it, the more I think having only one Big Ten BCS team is best
If we win this weekend, sure, it would be nice to play in a higher profile game, but I’d rather not see last years scenario play out again where two Big Ten teams get beaten in very high profile games, while the lesser teams are bumped up a notch to play a game they shouldn’t, leaving us a 1-6 record or whatever it was in bowls. Let Ohio State continue their tradition of SUCK in bowls.
Unless someone can talk me down from the ledge, I see no added benefit of getting an at large bid besides money, especially if we’re playing Boise.
Money is a pretty big added benefit.
I’m pretty sure it’s like 8 million in added benefit.
Land Grant or bust! Worst 10-2 team ever? Beat Michigan State.
Yeah, since the conference shares it, there's a pretty significant benefit to Iowa or PSU getting selected.
I agree that we’re better off record and perception wise with just 1 team. But the way this season is going nationally for CFB, and economically will be going for bowl revenue, I think it’s unrealistic to expect just 1 BCS team.
by PSUinBOSSton on Nov 16, 2009 11:11 AM EST up reply actions
It's hard for me to imagine
PSU, Iowa and Wiscy all getting passed on considering the alternatives.
BSD
They wouldn't, all 3 are too safe revenue wise.
by PSUinBOSSton on Nov 16, 2009 11:13 AM EST up reply actions
Was listening to the Steelers game yesterday
Hillgrove said the Steelers had (I believe) four more fans on Sunday than Pitt had on Saturday.
DO YOU HAVE PRIDE, DANNY?
by ReadingRambler on Nov 16, 2009 11:19 AM EST up reply actions
Can Pittsburgh lose to Cincinnati for a third time this year?
Deus nobiscum, quis contra?
by chocochuck02 on Nov 16, 2009 11:20 AM EST up reply actions
You forgot the dog
And I’m a Steeler fan, its not easy to accept, I know. Not hyper worried about it yet, though. I just don’t see the Bungles playing that lights out all season/postseason.
Deus nobiscum, quis contra?
by chocochuck02 on Nov 16, 2009 11:23 AM EST up reply actions
Ilkin and Wolfe said they were all sleepy
DO YOU HAVE PRIDE, DANNY?
by ReadingRambler on Nov 16, 2009 11:32 AM EST up reply actions
i was at that game on Saturday
about 65% of the stadium was ND fans.
Pitt fans were only loud on 3rd down. you could hardly tell that they are having a good season how quiet they were. though their Student Section was at the game on time. so they have that, but again, they were quiet compared to some others i’ve seen.
also we complain about piped in music at the Beaver…almost everything was piped in at Heinz.
"They say in Happy Valley that if God wasn’t a Penn State fan, why is the sky blue and white?" Fortt said. "Who am I to argue with God?"
Hey!
That was most of those students first college game in years!
Deus nobiscum, quis contra?
by chocochuck02 on Nov 16, 2009 11:56 AM EST up reply actions
No it wasn't
And those kids all have to figure out away to get from Oakland to downtown. Which involves either owing a car or taking a bus.
If our students had to take a bus to get to the game how many do you think would show up? I put the over under at about 1,500.
Land Grant or bust! Worst 10-2 team ever? Beat Michigan State.
I'm making zero excuses for our student section.
I’ve ranted about that before. Just referencing their brutal home attendance.
Deus nobiscum, quis contra?
by chocochuck02 on Nov 16, 2009 12:12 PM EST up reply actions
Pitt's home attendance might suck
But I wouldn’t trade one Pitt student for three Penn State students this year.
And other than 2005, that’s case much or often than not.
Land Grant or bust! Worst 10-2 team ever? Beat Michigan State.
I assume you're referencing students as fans
re: trading.
Because, if you were an employer, you’d trade one Pitt alum for the 3 Penn Staters, and more likely wouldn’t do the opposite, that is, trade one penn state grad for three pitt alums.
I wouldn't trust old rooster me neither.
That is unless they went
to Pitt’s Law School, Business School or Medical School, all of which are superior to Penn State’s
Land Grant or bust! Worst 10-2 team ever? Beat Michigan State.
I think we can agree that they're pretty even, in the long run.
Deus nobiscum, quis contra?
by chocochuck02 on Nov 16, 2009 12:24 PM EST up reply actions
At the graduate level?
No, I don’t think we can. Sorry.
Land Grant or bust! Worst 10-2 team ever? Beat Michigan State.
you can't?
Penn State has higher ranked Business and Law schools at the graduate level. Don’t know about Medical.
by PSUinBOSSton on Nov 16, 2009 12:32 PM EST up reply actions
Penn State has higher ranked grad programs in:
Business, Education, Engineering, and Law. Pitt is better in Medical, but still light years behind Penn.
Deus nobiscum, quis contra?
by chocochuck02 on Nov 16, 2009 12:43 PM EST up reply actions
yes, yes
undergraduates and whatnot.
Though lauding something as being better than PSU’s law school is sort of damning with faint praise.
I wouldn't trust old rooster me neither.
And neither of them are in the top 50 for law
So I hope chest thumping is kept to a minimum either way.
Deus nobiscum, quis contra?
by chocochuck02 on Nov 16, 2009 2:50 PM EST up reply actions
And really, thats kind of a cop out.
Pitt’s attendance has been lightyears better at Heinz Field than it was for like the last 15 years at Pitt Stadium, on campus. Its just harder for the students to make it to the games. But nobody goes because they suck.
Deus nobiscum, quis contra?
by chocochuck02 on Nov 16, 2009 12:18 PM EST up reply actions
I guess what I'm trying to say is
If Pitt doesn’t win and plays bad opponents, the attendance would be horrible even if the stadium was located at Panther Hollow.
Deus nobiscum, quis contra?
by chocochuck02 on Nov 16, 2009 12:21 PM EST up reply actions
I went to Pitt games throughout law school
Ticket we’re cheap, I had four sets for a total cost of about $80, and it was a fun place to tailgate.
I went to Penn State from 95-99 and Pitt from 00-02, and I can tell you that there might have been less students there, but they were louder and more into the game. They just were. And those were Walt Harris Pitt teams.
Land Grant or bust! Worst 10-2 team ever? Beat Michigan State.
not really a surprise, at Pitt the students who go are going to be ones that are actually hard core and care because the “casual fan” Pitt student ain’t going to games. PSU has a lot of students who go just for the fun and experience of football games.
I'm calling out my own kind here
but PSU also has a lot of students who are “die hards” (by their own misguided self-definition) who won’t show up for early/mediocre/bad-weathered games.
by dawsonPSU10 on Nov 16, 2009 12:43 PM EST up reply actions
Those students aren’t die-hards then. Your actions define you, not your words.
by Laaaaazzz on Nov 16, 2009 12:48 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
That's why it was in quotes
They’re self defined die-hards, who really only went to PSU to get totally trashed every weekend like the majority of the people from my HS graduating class that went to PSU.
Does Pitt have a
shuttle system for students to get to Heinz or are students on their own?
One man doing the work of 100's for the good of 1000's
You bet your bippy they have shuttles
Deus nobiscum, quis contra?
by chocochuck02 on Nov 16, 2009 12:53 PM EST up reply actions
And student parking
Deus nobiscum, quis contra?
by chocochuck02 on Nov 16, 2009 12:54 PM EST up reply actions
I know nothing about Pitt
other than the alums I know down here. My understanding is that it’s pretty easy to get to the tailgate lots. Also: a very large number of people that go to the tailgate lots watch the home games at local bars instead of just going into the stadium.
BSD
Unlike State College
Pittsburgh is built to accomodate traffic, getting to Heinz Field is umpteen times easier than getting to the Beav.
Deus nobiscum, quis contra?
by chocochuck02 on Nov 16, 2009 1:07 PM EST up reply actions
Thanks, I was asking
becasue jesse. made it sound like the sadsack students had to wait with the winos and poor people for a seat on the city buses.
A school operated shuttle system is not waiting for a bus.
How about light rail? Light rail into Baltimore is a party on game days.
One man doing the work of 100's for the good of 1000's
Go out and drink anywhere in Pittsburgh sometime
And you’ll see Pitt students have no problems getting out and about.
Deus nobiscum, quis contra?
by chocochuck02 on Nov 16, 2009 2:35 PM EST up reply actions
Oh sweet jesus
Or students complain, alot, about games that start at 12:00. It is a five minute walk to the stadium for about 45% of the on campus population.
My point isn’t so much that’s it hard for Pitt students to go to games, it’s that a stubbed toe on a Tuesday seems to be enought to keep our kids away on a Saturday.
Land Grant or bust! Worst 10-2 team ever? Beat Michigan State.
and about 1/4 of Penn State students live on campus
or about 13,500, a large portion of which are freshmen.
So we’ll give the “short walk” to ~7,000 students, which seems to be about what fills up quickly.
Again, not trying to excuse the students for missing games or showing up late, but it isn’t quite as easy as you make it out to be. They should still find a way to make it, though, even if they have to walk from Toftrees.
by The JuggerNitt on Nov 16, 2009 5:41 PM EST up reply actions
That's a little personal
Talking about my bippy and all…
"For me the game wasn’t grounded in reality. It was about the uniform you put on that turned you into a warrior. It was about the mythology of the battle, the victory, the defeat, the struggle." - Mike Reid, PSU '69
by jtothep on Nov 16, 2009 2:13 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Yes, Pitt has a shuttle system from Oakland.
From the Pitt web site:
#
Student Shuttle Service
- Student shuttle service will begin three and a half (3.5) hours prior to the kickoff time.
- Shuttle buses will board on Bigelow Blvd. located between the William Pitt Union and the Cathedral of Learning.
- Shuttle buses will drop-off at the Great Lawn Tailgate outside of Gate A up to 90 minutes prior to kickoff. Afterwards student shuttles will drop off at Point State Park and stduents can walk across the pedestrian bridge.
- At the conclusion of the first quarter, shuttle buses will begin to travel back to Oakland and will do so continuously throughout the game.
- To return to Oakland shuttle buses will board on Reedsdale Street near Gate B of Heinz Field.
- Shuttle buses located on General Robinson Street only depart after the conclusion of the game.
Student Parking
- Student parking reservation forms can be picked-up and completed at the William Pitt Union Ticket Office beginning the Wednesday prior to each home game.
- The William Pitt Union Ticket Office is open Monday thru Friday from 9:00am until 5:00pm
- Limited student parking reservation forms are available and are distributed on a first come basis.
- All students are required to present a valid Pitt Student I.D. and a valid game ticket to be eligible for student parking.
- The following information is also required upon registration for student parking: Vehicle make and model, Vehicle year, Vehicle Color, Vehicle License Plate Number, State in which the vehicle is registered
I think that is a better setup than having to walk 30 mins. to get to the game. So, a new Pitt excuse will have to be made for Pitt students.
by mundyscorner99 on Nov 16, 2009 12:55 PM EST up reply actions
I wonder what they did in 1980
when they finished #2 and still didn’t sell out games, on campus.
Deus nobiscum, quis contra?
by chocochuck02 on Nov 16, 2009 12:58 PM EST up reply actions
Nobody is making excuses for Pitt's students
To the extent excuses are being made, they are for Penn State’s. This is what I said;
If our students had to take a bus to get to the game how many do you think would show up? I put the over under at about 1,500.
I think it’s pretty dead on considering the turn out for the Indiana game. The fact that this is a discussion at all should be a pretty serious embarassment for the student body.
Land Grant or bust! Worst 10-2 team ever? Beat Michigan State.
One thing we're in total agreement on
Deus nobiscum, quis contra?
by chocochuck02 on Nov 16, 2009 4:06 PM EST up reply actions
I agree, students were never the problem
One of my friends just finished a 5 year career on the offensive line at WVU and claimed Pitt’s students were the “drunkest, loudest” he ever had to deal with (does anyone remember LeSean McCoy’s comments to that effect?). It’s the older alumni base that does not care about attending games at all.
Rose Bowl:
BCS #2: Iowa vs. Boise State
Capital One Bowl: Wisconsin vs. LSU
Outback: Penn State vs. Tennessee
Champs Sports Bowl: Northwestern vs. Some ACC team (I have no idea)
Alamo Bowl: Michigan State vs. Texas Tech or Oklahoma
Insight Bowl: Minnesota vs. Missouri? Kansas State? I dunno
Now, I would predict wins by Iowa, Wisconsin (LSU is overrated and I think it will finally show. Wisconsin’s offensive line is good too.), Penn State, and Northwestern (for their second bowl win ever (as long as they don’t play Clemson)) for 4-3.
Without second BCS bid:
Rose Bowl: Ohio State
Capital One Bowl: Iowa vs. LSU
Outback: Wisconsin vs. Tennessee
Champs Sports: Penn State vs. Some ACC team
Alamo Bowl: Northwestern vs. Oklahoma or Texas Tech
Insight: Michigan State vs. Missouri? Kansas State?
Christmas in Detroit Bowl: Minnesota vs. Northern Illinois (I…guess?)
I’d predict wins by Iowa, Wisconsin, Penn State, and Minnesota for 4-3. It could be 5-2 either way with an Ohio State win…but, you know…
DO YOU HAVE PRIDE, DANNY?
by ReadingRambler on Nov 16, 2009 11:06 AM EST up reply actions
Ohio State should be listed after the first "Rose Bowl:" obviously
DO YOU HAVE PRIDE, DANNY?
by ReadingRambler on Nov 16, 2009 11:07 AM EST up reply actions
FWIW, I think this is the year Fitz finally breaks through with a bowl victory
But I don’t think they matchup well with OU or TTU.
DO YOU HAVE PRIDE, DANNY?
by ReadingRambler on Nov 16, 2009 11:08 AM EST up reply actions
Why do you have Wisconsin above PSU
I agree with you, but just curious.
He thinks we're gonna lose to the fighting D'Antonio's
Deus nobiscum, quis contra?
by chocochuck02 on Nov 16, 2009 11:16 AM EST up reply actions
Because I think we're going to lose to MSU
Bielema might, MIGHT, pull a rabbit out of his hat and choke this week, but I doubt it.
DO YOU HAVE PRIDE, DANNY?
by ReadingRambler on Nov 16, 2009 11:16 AM EST up reply actions
If only
I thought this was going to be that jackass’s last year, and he hast to go and be a jackass and actually be halfway decent.
by dawsonPSU10 on Nov 16, 2009 12:20 PM EST up reply actions
Missouri over Kansas State.
K-State needs to beat Nebraska this weekend in Lincoln to become bowl eligible (AND win the Big XII North title) since they need seven wins instead of six. You can only count one FCS win for bowl eligibility.
This will probably all seem to fall into place...
and then Nebraska will win the Big 12 championship game
As much as I hate to say this
I don’t think the Big 10 deserves a second BCS bowl game. Granted, it’s not about “deserving” and a lot of conferences don’t look so hot this year, consider that O$U, our automatic bid, needed overtime to beat a freshman quarterback in his first start on their home field. And they lost to USC and Purdue. Iowa and PSU, then lost to these guys. I don’t like the disrepect that the B10 gets as a conference, but, I’m sorry, when I look at it that way, I don’t see how it deserves a second BCS bowl.
On the other hand, as it has been said here before, perhaps the more we see BCS bowl selections not based on the merits, maybe the closer it gets us to a real playoff.
"the secret to loving your job is having a hobby that you really despise"
Outside of a small handful of teams
There’s not many who do deserve BCS bowls this year.
Deus nobiscum, quis contra?
by chocochuck02 on Nov 16, 2009 11:28 AM EST up reply actions
Amen to that
I agree with this and the fact that no one deserves the Heisman.
Deserving teams would probably be
Bama, TCU, and Cincy.
Deus nobiscum, quis contra?
by chocochuck02 on Nov 16, 2009 11:31 AM EST up reply actions
I'm going to get yelled at
but I don’t think Bama deserves it either. They’ve had as few close calls as well, and probably should have lost to Tennessee. Plus I couldn’t stand watching replays of that blocked FG with that DT with the gigantic man boobs ripping off his helmet and running off the field celebrating while his jugs bounce up and down under his jersey.
by dawsonPSU10 on Nov 16, 2009 12:27 PM EST up reply actions
Oh, yes that's a great example of SEC refs
If Bama wasn’t undefeated, they would have handed Tennessee 15 yards and another shot at a FG.
DO YOU HAVE PRIDE, DANNY?
by ReadingRambler on Nov 16, 2009 12:29 PM EST up reply actions
While we're in a thread with BCS and PSU complaints and grievances, thats another thing
Is it possible for there to be a national referee committee or something? Have a pool of refs belong to one organization, and not to the conferences. Yeah so travel would suck, but have the home team pay for their flight or something. There’s WAAAAAYYY too many instances of refs giving favorable calls (this isn’t an Iowa jab, that was before they lost so it’s a moo point at this point) that clearly favor the “better” team who’s getting beaten by some lowly division team, but instead aren’t held accountable for their actions, and when a coach calls them out on it, the COACH gets reprimanded (I’m thinking of Tenn., and obviously Kiffin is a colossal doucheabag, but still if no one else is going to call out the refs, it’s got to be a coach). It’s getting kind of pathetic. This goes for Big Ten refs as much as SEC refs. Our refs need to learn how to call a freaking holding call.
There needs to be some way to keep these guys in check so there’s no favoring one team over another, and you don’t get some ref living in Ann Arbor calling a game for you in Michigan Stadium. There’s far too much interest in some of these games to have your refs from your own conference be officiating your games for you. They get paid by the conference, and have a conflict of interest in keeping a conference school in the national spotlight.
/Rant over
by dawsonPSU10 on Nov 16, 2009 12:42 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
Outside the South, what conferences deserve a second BCS bowl game more?
The Big 12? Okie State has two losses, too.
The Pac-10? Southern Cal has THREE losses.
The ACC? No.
The Big East? If Cincy is the conference champ, then no.
If we beat Sparty, PSU and Iowa don’t deserve it the least. I see Florida/Alabama, TCU, PSU, and a Top 5 Boise State making it in if Cincy wins the Big East.
I disagree with you if Georgia Tech goes 11-1 and loses the ACC championship.
by PSUinBOSSton on Nov 16, 2009 11:45 AM EST up reply actions
Here's where the nitpicking comes in
Then 2 loss GT already lost to 3 loss Miami(FL), who lost to Clemson and North Carolina.
Deus nobiscum, quis contra?
by chocochuck02 on Nov 16, 2009 11:51 AM EST up reply actions
True, but I think the real comparison becomes the best wins (if you are talking purely about resumes)
Tech would have wins over Va Tech, Clemson (and presumably a loss to them in that title game, which is why title games can be BS since it’s a rematch), and Georgia. Compare that to our best 3 of Temple . . . Minnesota? . . . and . . . Michigan State?
by PSUinBOSSton on Nov 16, 2009 11:56 AM EST up reply actions
I happen to think GT is a good team.
I’m just sayin. Hmm.. A win over 3 loss VT, 3 loss Clemson, and 4 loss Georgia? As opposed to 2 loss Temple, 4 loss Northwestern, and 5 loss Minnesota? Thats about a wash. With losses to 3 loss Miami(FL) and 3 loss Clemson? As opposed to 2 loss OSU and 2 loss Iowa? This is the problem with resume ranking.
Deus nobiscum, quis contra?
by chocochuck02 on Nov 16, 2009 12:03 PM EST up reply actions
No, this is why the statistical rankings are helpful
because you can’t look just at the number of wins/losses. You have to take into account who those wins/losses have come against. And the statistical rankings find ways to do this (some better than others) quickly and effectively.
FWIW, that 4-loss Georgia team is “statistically” better than any of Penn State’s wins, and is actually ranked fairly close to PSU in all of the rankings. Georgia is actually ahead of Penn State in Sagarin’s ELO Chess rankings (the one used for the BCS), but I have some issues with Sagarin.
"In the beginning the Universe was created.
This has made a lot of people very angry and been widely regarded as a bad move."
And maybe we're the worst 10-2 team ever
But I’d sure as hell rather have losses to OSU and Iowa than Purdue, jNW, or USC right now.
Deus nobiscum, quis contra?
Yeah,
Obviously we don’t like losing to anyone, but there’s something to be said for taking care of business and beating the teams you should. I get that we tend to extrapolate based on previous results, and those results suggest we can’t beat top tier teams. But if you want to talk “deserving”, we didn’t choke out to any Purdue or jNWs.
by PSUinBOSSton on Nov 16, 2009 11:45 AM EST up reply actions
Yes
I think this point gets loss in the shuffle. We sadly haven’t had any good wins, but the teams we’ve lost to are very good and we’ve taken care of everyone else like we should have. Not having losses to bad teams does have some reflection of quality for PSU.
I would much rather play in a BCS bowl than the capital one bowl...
In much the same way I would rather have an NCAA banner hangning in BJC than an NIT banner. I think that you always want to play on the biggest stage.
And, while not “legends”, if this team can make it to a BCS bowl and win, I would say that they arguably accomplished more than the 2008 Lions.
Of course, my dream scenario is for OhIo State to lose this weekend – so that if Penn State wins, OSU will have to say that they won 5 consecutive Big Ten titles, but 3 of them were shared with Penn State. Also, I would love to see them lose in the Rose and Penn State win in the Fiesta or Orange, so the story line would be Penn State takes care of business for the big ten…
by dontcallmescooter on Nov 16, 2009 12:48 PM EST reply actions
I only want a BCS bowl game if it's the Orange Bowl...
I’m just being selfish, though, because I will be able to go to a Florida bowl game, but not one in Arizona.
For the glory
I'd gladly go to Arizona for winter vacation
but I doubt my Dad will want to spend money on a bowl game trip if it’s against a Mid-major. He didn’t even want to go the the 05 Orange Bowl, which he says he regrets now in retrospect, but at the time saw no benefit of playing a 22nd ranked F$U, which is understandable given as how it probably wouldn’t have been as close as it was if Hunt and Poz hadn’t got injured. I think if I had gone to that game in person, being a HS senior at the time, I probably would have had a heart attack before the end.
no joke, I almost passed out twice during the game
of course, I found out soon afterwards that I had mono, but I’m sure the constantly screaming at the top of my lungs didn’t help much.
by The JuggerNitt on Nov 16, 2009 5:44 PM EST up reply actions
From the Pittsburgh Post-Gazette
And according to Dave Wannstedt it was an important win for this reason – there were 100 recruits or so in attendance and they were treated to a great crowd, a prime-time game and a team that actually plays an exciting brand of football these days.
Deus nobiscum, quis contra?
100 recruits?
Is it just me, or does this reek of “with a freaking 12 gauge, what do you think?”
Deus nobiscum, quis contra?
by chocochuck02 on Nov 16, 2009 1:36 PM EST up reply actions
Hey, Anthony, what’d you do in 2007?
I shot Wolverines in Michigan with Andrew Quarless! I told you.
What kind of gun did you use?
A frickin’ 12 gauge, whad do you think?!
sigh
DO YOU HAVE PRIDE, DANNY?
by ReadingRambler on Nov 16, 2009 2:11 PM EST up reply actions
Did you shoot any?
Yes, like 50 of ’em! They kept trying to attack my cousins, what the heck would you do in a situation like that?
Deus nobiscum, quis contra?
by chocochuck02 on Nov 16, 2009 2:13 PM EST up reply actions
All of you must be kidding?
You honestly think we deserve a BCS game? Not a chance. We played like a bunch of lost school girls against our 2 toughest opponents. We played extremely poorly against Northwestern and Indiana, but were lucky enough to end with a W.
If we get a BCS game, it will show the flaws in the system. Don’t get me wrong, I would love a BCS game, however, we DO NOT deserve to go to one.
I think very few people here say we deserve a BCS game
But if you can give me a rational argument for which 4 teams deserve it so much more that we shouldn’t even be in the discussion, I’ll give you a cookie.
As it stands right now (and assuming everything plays out as expected), the BCS are probably going to even be taking both TCU and Boise St, and still be taking a second Big 10 team.
Of the current BCS top 14, it includes the 6 likely conference champions (winner of Floribama, Texas, Cinci, GaTech, OSU, Oregon), as well as TCU (likely auto-bid), loser of Floribama (likely at large bid), LSU (not eligible due to 2 team per conference rule), Boise State (may get a bid), Pitt (will likely lose to Cinci, and if not, may knock Cinci out), OkSt (will possibly/probably lose to Oklahoma), Iowa and Penn State.
So you have the 7 auto-bids (conf champs + TCU) and loser of Floribama, leaving 2 spots for Boise St and Iowa or Penn State (or perhaps Pitt or OkSt if they are somehow able to win out. Of course with some of the teams currently in the top 14 losing, teams like Virginia Tech, Wisky, and Stanford could move up, but do you really think any of them are more deserving than PSU or Iowa?
So the only real question right now is what second Big 10 team should get the bid? The second team should probably be Iowa, since they are currently ranked 1 spot ahead of us (by a whopping 0.0402 margin) that could even change after this weekend depending on how the votes work out. And of course the more compelling reason is that they beat us head to head, and they travel well enough that PSU’s travel base won’t necessarily be a big enough factor to bump us ahead. But whoever has the pick is going to also look at Iowa losing 2 of their last 3, and either missing, or welcoming back a rusty QB.
Of course, if either PSU or Iowa lose this weekend, it will pretty much seal up the bid for the other team (assuming they win).
by The JuggerNitt on Nov 17, 2009 9:28 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Do you have chocolate chip?
First, if it comes down to Iowa or us, Iowa deserves it. They beat us head to head. There is simply no jusification for us to be placed in a BCS game over them. But, as it has happened in the past, it simply exposes another flaw to the BCS system.
Boise, should they win out, deserves it over us. Lets not forget they beat a pretty good Oregon team. Yes, their schedule is weak, but so is ours, so there goes that argument.
Any team in the BCS standings that is undefeated, deserves it over us. TCU, Cinci, Boise, etc. The argument over who travels well is an weak one, seeing as in theory, it should not matter. However, you and I both know $$$ is a top priority of the BCS, and not necessarily putting in the right team.
I don’t care what anyone says. You can not justify putting in a 2 loss team (2 losses against our only tough competition) (assuming it won’t be 3), over a team that 1. beat us, or 2. an undefeated team.
He's not justifying taking us over an undefeated team
As it stands right now (and assuming everything plays out as expected), the BCS are probably going to even be taking both TCU and Boise St, and still be taking a second Big 10 team.
Any other “team in the BCS standings that is undefeated” will get an autobid as conference champion. Therefore, you appear to agree that a Big Team will get the fourth at-large bid to the BCS.
Honestly, any of the two-Big Ten loss teams (Iowa, PSU, & Wiscy) could go down this weekend to their opponents (Minnesota, MSU, & NW, respectively).
Right but...
It should not be us is what I am saying. We don’t deserve it. Its like in school, if you have a 90, and another student has a 99, unless your school has a A+, A, A- system, both get recognized for having an A, when in reality, the student with the 99 should get higher praise and recognition.
It's really Embarrassing what we've become
Cant compete on the field, pad your schedule with cupcakes, sell seat licenses. Have to perpetuate the fraud to sell those licenses. This is who we are. Schedule 5 “subdivision” teams, play an increasingly mediocre Big 10 schedule, go 11 and 1 go to a big bowl, keep the myth alive. Raise the seat license fee. What is our biggest win this year? It really looks like Temple. What happens to the program and the Conference if Alabama beats us badly 2 years in a row?
We take our lumps from the sky falling on our head?
"For me the game wasn’t grounded in reality. It was about the uniform you put on that turned you into a warrior. It was about the mythology of the battle, the victory, the defeat, the struggle." - Mike Reid, PSU '69
KEEP THE MYTH ALIVE
KILL TR88! KEEP THE MYTH ALIVE! KILL HIM TO PREVENT THE MYTH FROM DYING!
DO YOU HAVE PRIDE, DANNY?
by ReadingRambler on Nov 17, 2009 11:35 AM EST up reply actions
None of this is a secret
It’s pretty widely circulated informaton. Cavet emptor Orange Bowl, caveat emptor.
If they want us, they get us. End of story.
Land Grant or bust! Worst 10-2 team ever? Beat Michigan State.
PSU won't outsell Iowa at Fiesta or Orange
The mistaken notion most repeated in this series of threads is that PSU would be picked over Iowa on the basis of Brand name. Sure the system would allow for it because anyone in the Top 14 can be chosen, but the Fiesta and Orange Bowls would both take Iowa over PSU if they win on Saturday.
Iowa sold nearly 50,000 tickets to the 2002 Orange Bowl, vastly outnumbering USC fans. And in a 2004 road game at ASU, 20,000 Hawkeye fans showed up, and that was for a non-conference game at the beginning of the year.
As someone who has bought and sold tickets to the Orange, Fiesta, Cap1, & Outback bowls over the last 10 years, other than tOSU (and I hate saying that) Iowa is the biggest ticket draw in the Big 10.
Consider this as well: 4 years ago Michigan beat Iowa and had the same record, but the Outback Bowl picked Iowa sending the Wolverines to the Alamo Bowl. Wait, isn’t Michigan one of the marquee brands of the Big Ten?
Now if you substitute Wisky for Iowa, and Wisky is #13 and beat a #14 PSU during the year, PSU likely does jump the Badgers because while rabid at home at Camp Randall. If it’s not the Rose Bowl, Wisky fans tend to stay home.
Jesse Palmer uses his hands more when he's talking than Marlee Matlin
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