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Around SBN: Identifying The 19th-Best Team In Baseball

The Endgame (Outside Projections Added)

 It's unfortunate that every "good" weekend for Penn State since the beginning of the year has had to do mostly with other teams losing, allowing us to move up instead of us making our own statements, or taking our destiny into our own hands, but this weekend was a good one for Penn State nonetheless.

-Pitt's already microscopic at-large chances went out the window after losing to West Virginia

-Oklahoma State went fetal against Big Game Bob, eliminating the 'pokes from the BCS chase.

-Georgia Tech lost to Georgia, which, regardless of what happens in the title game, likely makes the ACC a one bid league.

So...

-Florida, Texas, Cincinatti, Oregon, Georgia Tech, and Ohio State are projected to be safely in the BCS as conference champions.

-The following teams are still in the hunt for the remaining 4 BCS spots (ranking reflects week 13 ranking until new standings are released): #2 Alabama, #4 TCU, #6 Boise State, #11 Iowa, #13 Penn State, #14 Virginia Tech.

-Only 3 games remain that could shake up the BCS picture: Oregon vs. Oregon St. in the Civil War on Thursday, Texas vs. Nebraska in the Big XII Championship Saturday, and Pitt vs. Cincinatti in the "River City Rivalry"/Big East Championship on Saturday.  If Oregon were to lose, Oregon St. would play in the Rose Bowl, and Oregon would enter the at-large pool, and would pretty much bet a slam dunk to steal a bid.    A Texas loss sends Nebraska to the Fiesta Bowl as Big XII champ and Texas to the at-large pool where they too would be a virtual lock to be selected. Finally, a Pitt win over Cincinatti throws the Bearcats into the at-large mix, but their lack of a following makes their status more uncertain than Oregon's.

Remember, ACC champ is tied to the Orange Bowl, Pac-10 and Big 10 to the Rose Bowl, Big XII to Fiesta, and SEC to Sugar (though SEC champ will surely play for MNC).

So, let's go through the scenarios:

Star-divide

Scenario One: Chalk Holds

Under this scenario, Oregon goes safely into the Rose Bowl, Texas into the MNC, and Cincinatti takes it's place as a "floater" because the Big East has no BCS tie in.  I would project the picks to go as follows:

Pick 1-Sugar bowl picks loser of SEC Championship.  Pick 2-Fiesta chooses between Penn State and Iowa (Big 10 can't have more than 2 teams in the BCS).  Pick 3-Orange selects TCU or Cincinatti.  Pick 4-IF Orange selects TCU, Fiesta chooses between Boise St. and Cincinatti.  IF Orange selects Cincinatti, Fiesta takes TCU as the highest ranked non-qualifier.  Pick 5-IF Orange selects TCU, Sugar chooses between Cincinatti or Boise St., whichever Fiesta does not select, and Virginia Tech.  IF Orange selects Cincinatti, and Fiesta selects TCU, Sugar chooses between Boise St. and Virginia Tech.

My bowl projections:

MNC: Texas vs. Florida/Alabama

Rose: Oregon vs. Ohio State

Fiesta: Iowa/Penn State vs. Cincinatti

Orange: Georgia Tech/Clemson vs. TCU

Sugar: Alabama/Florida vs. Boise St.

Scenario 2: Ducks Hunted

If Oregon enters the at large by losing to Oregon St., but Cincinnati and Texas hold on, things get more interesting.  Either PSU/Iowa or Boise St. will lose a bid, and because of Boise's non-qualifier status, I project it to be Boise.

Pick 1-Sugar selects SEC championship loser.  Pick 2-Fiesta chooses between Iowa/Penn State and Oregon.  Pick 3-Orange selects either PSU/Iowa or Oregon, whichever Fiesta doesn't select.  Pick 4-Fiesta selects TCU or Cincinnati.  Pick 5-Sugar selects either TCU or Cincinnati, whichever Fiesta doesn't.

My projections:

MNC: Texas vs. Florida/Alabama

Rose: Oregon St. vs. Ohio St.

Fiesta: Oregon vs. TCU

Orange: PSU/Iowa vs. Georgia Tech/Clemson

Sugar: Alabama/Florida vs. Cincinnati

*Note: The Fiesta's selection between Oregon and PSU/Iowa would be a virtual toss-up.  My belief is that Orange would prefer PSU/Iowa to Oregon more than the Fiesta would prefer Iowa/Penn State to Oregon, and that the Orange and Fiesta bowls would strike a deal to make the above scenario happen, but that's just me.  It could go either way.

Scenario Three: Longhorns Lose

This scenario assumes Texas loses, and Cincinatti and Oregon hold.  This would make things pretty clear cut,, as Nebraska would move into the Fiesta Bowl as part of the Big XII's tie-in, and Texas into a very muddled at-large pool.  Though there will likely be an argument whether current #4 and non-qualifier TCU deserves a BCS title bid or not, for the purposes of this discussion, we'll assume they'll play for the MNC

Pick 1-Sugar selects loser of SEC Championship.  Pick 2-Orange selects Texas.  Pick 3-Fiesta selects PSU/Iowa  Pick 4-Sugar selects Cincinnati.

Bowl Projections:

MNC: Florida/Alabama vs. TCU

Rose: Oregon vs. Ohio State

Fiesta: Nebraska vs. PSU/Iowa

Orange: Texas vs. Georgia Tech/Clemson

Sugar: Alabama/Florida vs. Cincinnati

Scenario Four: Bearcats Busted

This scenario assumes Oregon and Texas hold, while Cincinnati falls to Pitt.  The Bearcats would enter the at-large pool, but there'd probably be a debate as to whether they'll stay in it as a one loss Big East team with a small following.  However, considering Cincinnati's competition would be a non-qualifier in Boise, and considering TCU, another non-qualifier will be safely ranked ahead of Boise, I'm projecting the Bearcats will just make the cut.

Pick 1-Sugar selects SEC Championship loser.  Pick 2-Fiesta selects PSU/Iowa.  Pick 3-Orange selects Pitt or TCU.  Pick 4-Fiesta selects Pitt or TCU, whichever Orange does not select.  Pick 5-Sugar selects Cincinnati or Boise St.

Bowl Projections:

MNC: Florida/Alabama vs. Texas

Rose: Oregon vs. Ohio State

Fiesta: Pitt vs. Iowa/PSU

Orange: Clemson/Georgia Tech vs. TCU

Sugar: Florida/Alabama vs. Cincinnati

Scenario Five: Oregon AND Cincinnati lose

This scenario will eliminate either PSU/Iowa or Cincinnati.  We'll assume it'll be Cincinnati because of the lack of a following compared to PSU and Iowa.

Pick 1-Sugar selects SEC Championship loser.  Pick 2-Fiesta selects PSU/Iowa or Oregon.  Pick 3-Orange selects PSU/Iowa or Oregon, whichever Fiesta does not.  Pick 4-Fiesta selects Pitt or TCU.  Pick 5-Sugar selects Pitt or TCU, whichever Fiesta does not. 

Bowl Projections:

See scenario #2.  Replace Cincinnati with Pitt in the Sugar Bowl.

Scenario Six: Texas AND Cincinnati lose

Here, things look much like scenarios #5 and #3, in that Cincinnati likely hits the bricks.

Pick 1-Sugar selects SEC Championship loser.  Pick 2-Orange selects Texas.  Pick 3-Fiesta selects PSU/Iowa.  Pick 4- Sugar selects Pitt.

Bowl Projections:

See scenario #3, and replace Cincinnati with Pitt in Sugar Bowl.

Scenario 7: Texas AND Oregon lose

This scenario means only Oregon OR Penn State/Iowa will make the BCS.  It also eliminates Cincinnati in the event of a loss to Pitt.

Pick 1-Sugar selects SEC Championship loser.  Pick 2-Orange Selects Texas.  Pick 3-Fiesta selects Oregon OR PSU/Iowa.  Pick 4-Sugar selects Cincinnati/Pitt, whichever wins the Big East.

Bowl Projections:

MNC: Florida/Alabama vs. TCU

Rose: Oregon St. vs. Ohio St.

Fiesta: Nebraska vs. PSU/Iowa

Orange: Texas vs. Georgia Tech/Clemson

Sugar: Florida/Alabama vs. Cincinnati/Pitt

So if you're Penn State, what scenarios are you hoping for most?  Well, it seems the consensus is that Fiesta likes Iowa more than Penn State, and Orange likes Penn State more than Iowa.  While that's all speculation, for the purposes of this discussion, we'll assume it's well-grounded and make it our frame of reference.

As a Penn State fan, any scenario that gives Iowa/Penn State a chance at the Orange is best.  A scenario with Pitt winning the Big East and in the Fiesta Bowl would probably be the next most desirable, because the Fiesta Bowl would probably prefer a Pitt/Penn State matchup to a Pitt/Iowa matchup from a marketing perspective.  Finally, and scenario where Fiesta is choosing between Pitt and Penn State to play either a non-qualifier or Cincinnati is probably least desirable. 

Remember, none of this is binding.  The bowls can do pretty much whatever they want, but using what we know, I'd say the odds are very good that we see one of the seven scenarios I listed above playing out between now and December 6 when the BCS bowls are announced.

Overall, I'm pretty bearish on our BCS chances.  Five of the seven scenarios have either of the Big 10 teams in the Fiesta Bowl, where we're believed to be behind Iowa, and I would only consider Penn State to be ahead of Iowa in three of the seven (2, 4, and 5).  We'll see though, I suppose.

And finally, if you find fault with this, realize that it's 3 AM, and that I might have missed something.  I'm not an idiot, I'm just tired...

UPDATE: Here are CBS's projections, and here are ESPN's.  Both are pretty much in lock step with Scenario #1, only none have Penn State being chosen.  It's time to start rooting for upsets.

At this point, as I said earlier, Scenarios 2 and 5 are most advantageous for Penn State.  It might be a long shot that Oregon could open up the Orange Bowl, but there's a chance they could, so hope for that.

If Oregon wins, I see Scenario 4 as the next best.   Though there has been considerable debate as to how much weight Pitt could have in the Penn State/Iowa selection, even odds as low as 1% are better than what Penn State faces in the other scenarios.  However, IcersGuy adds a new scenario in the comments below, which I'm pulling up here:

I’m adding a new scenario, and one that makes a few large assumptions. Lets assume Texas, Oregon, Cincy, and Clemson win their respective conferences next week. Now for the big assumptions:

1st – The bowls are willing to overlook Boise State and their undefeated season in order to get a better selling match-up.
2nd – The loss by Georgia Tech slides them out of the top 14 in the BCS. With the #15 and #16 teams losing (Pitt and Oregon State), SWAG U slides into the top 14. I hope you’ve now guessed where I’m going with this….
3rd – The Orange Bowl agrees to take TCU or Cincy, because they’ll be getting an undefeated team. Ok, it’s really just for argument’s sake, but I was trying to find a reason.

This would be the bowl breakdown:

MNC: Texas vs. Florida/Alabama
Rose: Oregon vs. Ohio State
Fiesta: Iowa/Penn State vs. Miami (FL)
Orange: Clemson vs. TCU/Cincy
Sugar: Alabama/Florida vs. TCU/Cincy

A certain "rematch" in the Fiesta Bowl? Why not?

It's a longshot too, but in keeping with the "Dumb and Dumber" theme of the week so far, I'm "sayin' theres a chance!!!"

 

And for those of you who've been making fun of me in the Paul Jones fanshot...

 

Poll
If you're a Penn State fan, what scenario do you believe is best for Penn State to make a BCS bowl?
Scenario One: Chalk Holds
224 votes
Scenario Two: Oregon loses
26 votes
Scenario Three: Texas loses
28 votes
Scenario Four: Cincinnati loses
60 votes
Scenario Five: Oregon and Cincinnati lose
47 votes
Scenario Six: Texas and Cincinnati lose
12 votes
Scenario Seven: Oregon and Texas lose
11 votes

408 votes | Poll has closed

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The Mind Boggles...

…well done post, really interesting based on your model I think Penn St has a better than average BCS shot.

by JoePaMustStay on Nov 29, 2009 8:01 AM EST reply actions  

I think

Any scenario that pushes the Iowa/PSU bid toward the Orange bowl favors us immensely. I think Ferentz is in bed with the Fiesta Bowl people, literally.

"We hugged as grown men do. It was a great moment. Then, it was business as usual." -- LJ Sr.

by millzners on Nov 29, 2009 9:12 AM EST reply actions  

Here's what happens:

Iowa goes to Scottsdale, we don’t.
UNLESS Nebraska wins, in which case we’re in the Orange.

That’s it. Those are the only options that affect us, really.

NittanyWhiteOut.com. Arguably the second best Penn State blog I know of.

by PSUdevon on Nov 29, 2009 9:19 AM EST reply actions  

I don't think it's that certain for Iowa and the Fiesta.

But basically you’re saying that we’re better off head to head with Texas for the Orange? Is the ACC tie in official? Or is it more like the big east? If they actually have to pick twice, and the second pick happens before Sugar, then you’re right and maybe they will abandon the ACC and leave them to someone else. But I thought they were tied, which means that if Orange takes Texas we’re back to the Fiesta. No matter what sounds like Sugar is stuck with big east, haha.

by PSUinBOSSton on Nov 29, 2009 10:29 AM EST up reply actions  

ACC Tie-In

Yes, it is official, so there’s no getting around it. Scenarios 3 and 6 are pretty much locked into place. Remember: Texas can’t play in Fiesta, and there’s no way they fall to the Sugar Bowl while Orange picks a Big East team. I’d consider those two as the worst-case scenarios for Penn State.

God Created the World Out Of Nothing, Paterno Built A National Superpower On Cow Fields...

by Adam Bittner on Nov 29, 2009 10:54 AM EST up reply actions  

I too am not convinced that the Fiesta would pick Iowa instead of PSU. Though I don’t see any realistic scenario that puts a Big Ten team in the Orange at this point, so it comes down to who the Fiesta wants more. The Fiesta will take a Big Ten team with their first pick (to replace Texas). If Texas loses and Nebraska goes to the Fiesta, then the Orange will take a 1 loss Texas team for their at large spot and the Fiesta will take Iowa/PSU to face Nebraska. That’s it.

by Laaaaazzz on Nov 29, 2009 11:49 AM EST up reply actions  

OK

Well the Fiesta Bowl is in Glendale but…

Scenario 4 is probably good for Penn State. Fiesta will end up with Pitt almost no matter what, and they’ll be choosing between us and Iowa to play them. Save me your “regional matchup” rant. If no one would care about Pitt-Penn State, less would care about Iowa-Pitt and that’s a fact. Fiesta knows that, and in the event they’re stuck with Pitt, Penn State is going to play them in the Fiesta Bowl.

God Created the World Out Of Nothing, Paterno Built A National Superpower On Cow Fields...

by Adam Bittner on Nov 29, 2009 10:51 AM EST up reply actions  

No, it's not a fact. The only people who would care any differently are the Pitt fans.

And they aren’t the ones Fiesta is counting on to fill seats. The Fiesta is going to be counting on either Iowa or Penn State fans to carry that game. If they believe the Iowa fans will fill up the whole stadium, they will take them.

What I really don’t understand is your insistence that Pitt is going to the Fiesta. Sugar picks last don’t they? Then Sugar is getting the big east rep. No doubt in my mind.

by PSUinBOSSton on Nov 29, 2009 12:24 PM EST up reply actions  

EXACTLY!!!!!

THE ONLY PEOPLE THAT WOULD CARE ANY DIFFERENT ARE THE PITT FANS!!

They’re half thr equation in this. If you’re stuck with them, then you’ve gotta try and get the most out of them, and Penn State would get the absolute most out of Pitt. If Iowa=PSU, then PSU goes ahead of Iowa in scenario 4 because they’re a bigger draw for Pitt fans.

And Pitt would be picked by Fiesta because the alternative would be Boise, Cincy, or a 3 loss, all of which Pitt is more appealing than. USC isn’t making up 6 spots in the rankings in one week.

God Created the World Out Of Nothing, Paterno Built A National Superpower On Cow Fields...

by Adam Bittner on Nov 29, 2009 12:41 PM EST up reply actions  

USC has two weeks.

And they play a fairly well regarded Arizona next week. I think it will be close.

I guess our disagreement boils down to this: In my opinion, a 3 loss at large will be taken before any big east team. But hey, I’ve been wrong before.

Either way, it’s better for PSU to go to the cap one bowl than play pitt in the BCS. So if that’s my choice, good luck Iowa.

by PSUinBOSSton on Nov 29, 2009 12:45 PM EST up reply actions  

Yeah that's the disagreement

But regardless, I think Fiesta would take Pitt with the 2nd to last pick, leaving the 3 loss, Boise, or Cincy to Sugar. My money would be on Cincy getting the last bid because at some point, you’ve got to look at the entertainment factor. Does anyone want to watch Florida/Alabama play a clearly flawed 3 loss team from the Pac-10 or ACC? I’m not so certain.

Maybe USC or Oregon could fill more seats, but I think Florida/Alabama vs. Cincinnati would be a better national ratings draw, simply because Cincy is a damn good football team while USC and Oregon would be ho-hum 3 loss teams. But tht’s just me.

God Created the World Out Of Nothing, Paterno Built A National Superpower On Cow Fields...

by Adam Bittner on Nov 29, 2009 4:57 PM EST up reply actions  

Does anyone want to watch them play Cincy?

The ratings and attendance last year were a disaster. Are we that far removed for the BCS selection folks to do it again? If Clemson wins, then the Orange is in a tough spot without TCU a reality. They are left with the big east champ, boise st, or one of the 3 lossers. I think that’s the only scenario we might see a big east team somewhere other than the sugar.

by PSUinBOSSton on Nov 29, 2009 8:30 PM EST up reply actions  

We almost played a rematch last year

And a rematch with TCU is about the only way to make Clemson compelling TV, save for CJ Spiller.

God Created the World Out Of Nothing, Paterno Built A National Superpower On Cow Fields...

by Adam Bittner on Nov 29, 2009 4:51 PM EST up reply actions  

Maybe for a national audience

But the south is full of Clemson fans. I think if you had an ACC choice Clemson would be the better pick.

I am Laura Nichols and I like Bacon.

BSD is an addiction, and this is the first step.

by carolinaeasy on Nov 29, 2009 5:08 PM EST up reply actions  

yeah

I don’t see a rematch happening. And Clemson is a HUGE draw. Clemson in a BCS game would be similar to us in 2005.

by PSUinBOSSton on Nov 29, 2009 8:21 PM EST up reply actions  

Orange

I’m going to hope for 2 because I think the Orange Bowl against the ACC Champ would be a good game for the program. I think PSU can handle either of the ACC options and I think we look better in finally having the "quality win this year. I not sure about how I feel about us playing one of the “buster teams” only because IF we lose, I feel we’ll never hear the end of it and TCU I think is a really solid team this year. With special teams being what they are, Cincy could burn us there. That kid Gilyard they have has been solid on returns.

Sure, maybe not totally optimistic, but not entirely pessimistic either.

by MGPardoePSU on Nov 29, 2009 9:40 AM EST reply actions  

doesn't our history with the Fiesta Bowl play a role in this?

"We are not normal. We are legends. We are Penn State." - Deon Butler

by Stately NOVA Lion on Nov 29, 2009 10:01 AM EST reply actions  

I demand zug as an answer

It is the only response I could remotely understand.

A word to the wise ain't necessary - it's the stupid ones that need the advice.
Bill Cosby

by psu on Nov 29, 2009 10:11 AM EST reply actions   2 recs

Whats with the Oregon stealing a bid talk

if they lose to OreST they’ll have 3 losses, and I don’t think they would get a bid in that situation

by whiteoutonly on Nov 29, 2009 10:28 AM EST reply actions  

I think we very well could see a 3 loss team this year.

But I don’t know that Oregon is straight up in if they lose. I think in that scenario Oregon, Va Tech, Miami, and I’ll be keeping my eye on USC in the polls, are all equally likely.

by PSUinBOSSton on Nov 29, 2009 10:45 AM EST up reply actions  

Remember though

We’re talking about the Fiesta Bowl. I would think Oregon would be the more likely option for that bowl than either ACC team (although Miami does have a history…).

God Created the World Out Of Nothing, Paterno Built A National Superpower On Cow Fields...

by Adam Bittner on Nov 29, 2009 10:48 AM EST up reply actions  

Disagree

The Fiesta won’t take a 3 loss Oregon team instead of a 2 loss Big Ten team with their first pick.

The Fiesta might take a 3 loss Pac-10 team as their second at large team to face Iowa/PSU instead of Boise St — though I think that would be more likely to be USC than Oregon.

by Laaaaazzz on Nov 29, 2009 11:51 AM EST up reply actions  

I'm kind of with you Laaaaazzz

I can’t imagine Oregon getting an at-large bid if they lose to OSU. I realize $$$$ talk in the bowls, but Oregon with two Pac 10 losses and the Boise State fiasco just doesn’t appeal to me. In fact might drop them past 14. I would think in the scenario that Oregon loses on Thursday, USC begins to have the door just “slightly” opened for a trip to the desert! Only thing is, USC has 3 Pac 10 losses, so they are very underserving…but highly loved.

I just think we don’t belong …hopefully Iowa gets the shot and we go to Orlando as planned.

Perfection is not attainable, but if we chase perfection we can catch excellence.
Vince Lombardi

by PaJoe on Nov 29, 2009 12:00 PM EST up reply actions  

Yeah

The more we go through this, the more I think cap one gives us the highest reward. Beating LSU/SEC is a bettet game than anything we could get in the Fiesta.

by PSUinBOSSton on Nov 29, 2009 12:27 PM EST up reply actions  

Also agree.

USC plays next week, and the voters can propel them up if it looks like they have an at large shot.

by PSUinBOSSton on Nov 29, 2009 12:31 PM EST up reply actions  

Agreed

No way they get in ahead of a two-loss Big Ten or Boise State.

by SpartanDan on Nov 29, 2009 5:02 PM EST up reply actions  

Hate to break it to you but...

We’re not going to a BCS bowl. Under no circumstances do we deserve to go ahead of Iowa. So book your ticket to the Capital One Bowl.

by MrBrianPSU on Nov 29, 2009 10:55 AM EST reply actions  

Deserve?

No one said we deserved it. It’s all about the Benjamins baby

God Created the World Out Of Nothing, Paterno Built A National Superpower On Cow Fields...

by Adam Bittner on Nov 29, 2009 11:00 AM EST up reply actions  

This is all the bowls see...

God Created the World Out Of Nothing, Paterno Built A National Superpower On Cow Fields...

by Adam Bittner on Nov 29, 2009 11:02 AM EST up reply actions  

-1 for deserve as a factor they discuss.

That’s why I don’t think Boise has much of a chance, and we will see one of these other 3 loss teams.

by PSUinBOSSton on Nov 29, 2009 12:28 PM EST up reply actions  

LOL, you are funny.

So are you going to compensate me if I book my tickets, airfare, and hotel room to the Capital One Bowl, and PSU winds up going to a BCS bowl? Ready to put your $ where your mouth is? If not, then you have to admit that there are circumstances where we will go.

by The JuggerNitt on Nov 29, 2009 12:56 PM EST up reply actions  

the only circumstances would be if iowa gets the swine flu and are unable to compete….. otherwise………its capital one. no hassle. ha

by MrBrianPSU on Nov 29, 2009 10:34 PM EST up reply actions  

ok, so is that a yes, you will compensate me for tickets

if I buy four Capital 1 tickets, 2 hotel rooms for 4 nights, and airfare for 4, plus any other attractions I may decide to attend (such as Disney World) right now, and we wind up getting picked for a BCS bowl? Iowa getting the swine flu would have nothing to do with anything, as they’d be recovered by the time the game comes around,.

This is all I’m asking, since you seem so certain. Are you willing to put your money where your mouth is? I agree it is our likely destination, but in no way a certainty.

by The JuggerNitt on Nov 30, 2009 3:05 PM EST up reply actions  

Holy crap

so to review…typically whatever team could make some bowl game a ton of money, and is eligible for them to choose (top 14 ranking) is going to be chosen. If any of these greedy people had a conscience they would be in a rush to formulate a playoff between all these unbeatens.

So for this and all future BCS at-large discussions, and as several people have already pointed out, put yourself in the shoes of the greedy rich people and think about which matchups would make you richer. Deserve is for poor people.

by jimbo2psu on Nov 30, 2009 11:16 AM EST up reply actions  

Days ago...

I said WE ARE going to the CAP 1 Bowl…thanks to MrBrianPSU for reiterating same…but FUGI needless to say $$$$ talks.

by DerryPharmer on Nov 29, 2009 11:23 AM EST reply actions  

Slight tangent

But Penn State and Iowa are now both in the top 10 in the AP and USA Today polls. If you told me after the loss to Ohio State that Penn State would still finish the season in the top 10 in the human polls, I’d have called you crazy.

"In the beginning the Universe was created.
This has made a lot of people very angry and been widely regarded as a bad move."

by IcersGuy on Nov 29, 2009 3:05 PM EST reply actions  

Well, it's always nice...

To see everyone else in the country performing exceptionally mediocre as well, that is.

by mvrck on Nov 29, 2009 3:13 PM EST up reply actions  

That's an easy rec

"In the beginning the Universe was created.
This has made a lot of people very angry and been widely regarded as a bad move."

by IcersGuy on Nov 29, 2009 4:00 PM EST up reply actions  

2008 Utah vs. 1984 BYU would be freaking kickass. Go Utes.

That is all.

"I don't know. I don't know. [waves hand dismissively] First, you'd have to tell me what a 'BCS' is. I don't know."

by ReadingRambler on Nov 29, 2009 4:04 PM EST up reply actions  

WOW dude

literary genius the likes of which I’ve never seen, right there. I laughed, I cried, I lost 5 lbs. Rec’d.

by jimbo2psu on Nov 30, 2009 11:19 AM EST up reply actions  

All great scenarios...

But even if PSU makes BCS, they kind of get put into a no-win situation. In the case of a win, people just say big deal you beat a Big East/WAC/MWC team. In a loss, not only does the school get ridiculed saying we shouldn’t have been there, we deal with the shame of losing to a Big East/WAC/MWC team. Losses to those teams can be devastating, choklahoma hasn’t been the same since losing to Boise and we all remember Pitt began a big slump after Alex Smith single-handedly raped them. However, a BCS bid is still better than the Capitol One

by Goochie-Man on Nov 29, 2009 6:07 PM EST reply actions  

Ehh...

OU’s loss to Boise was only one in the middle of a string of epic choke jobs. I’d argue that the beatdown they got from USC in the Orange Bowl was probably where things went horribly wrong for them.

As for Pitt, they were going to suck after that Fiesta Bowl regardless. They shouldn’t have been in that game to start with (4 way tie for Big East title that year), and the cupboards were going to be bare in 2005 regardless of whether they won that game.

Alabama lost to Utah last year, and you barely here anyone talk about that, nor do people talk about Pitt losing to Utah outside PA. The only reason we remember the Boise-OU game is because it was epic.

And let’s not forget that these might be the two best non-qualifiers we’ve seen in the BCS era.

God Created the World Out Of Nothing, Paterno Built A National Superpower On Cow Fields...

by Adam Bittner on Nov 29, 2009 6:47 PM EST up reply actions  

BCS #11

I don’t understand why GT is ahead of us. Jeff Sagarin is killing us. How could we not even be in his rankings? He has a definite bias against B10 schools. Massey and Wolfe are also biased to a lesser degree.

"The name on the front of the jersey is what really matters, not the name on the back" --Joe Paterno

by JuniataMan on Nov 29, 2009 8:44 PM EST reply actions  

Doesn't matter this year.

It only matters for the NC game. As for the computers, I don’t think they are going to keep anyone out of the top 14 that you could argue MUST go to another BCS game or anything like that.

Also, do you really feel like we’re a better team than Tech? I’m not so sure.

by PSUinBOSSton on Nov 29, 2009 8:48 PM EST up reply actions  

They have a better SOS, but are they better than us? I don't think so

Did you watch their game last night? Georgia – who hasn’t been great in any facet of offense this year – ran all over them. GT’s defense isn’t very good at all.

As for the flexbone, I’m pretty sure Penn State would do well defending them.

"I don't know. I don't know. [waves hand dismissively] First, you'd have to tell me what a 'BCS' is. I don't know."

by ReadingRambler on Nov 29, 2009 8:51 PM EST up reply actions  

I Expected GT to be ahead...

Just look at their wins. They beat the hell out of us.

God Created the World Out Of Nothing, Paterno Built A National Superpower On Cow Fields...

by Adam Bittner on Nov 29, 2009 8:49 PM EST up reply actions  

lol, yes, that statistical formula he developed years ago to comply with the BCS rules

is certainly biased towards Big 10 teams. The real problem for us is that we put an upper cap on where we should be (lost to both OSU and Iowa, so we “should” be below 22 in the ELO_CHESS) while the lower limit we placed for ourselves was that we beat all the teams ranked 68 and lower. So we fall somewhere in between there (in essence…it is a little bit more complex than that).

His more accurate “Predictor” ratings actually have us at #12, but it uses margin of victory, and so can’t be used in the BCS formula.

by The JuggerNitt on Nov 30, 2009 3:12 PM EST up reply actions  

PSUinBOSSton

Just some quick numbers for you.

Pitt played 8 of its games on an ESPN national tier, the same number as Penn State. They played 3 on ABC.

Am I saying Pitt=Penn State in terms of visbility? Certainly not.

But as the BCS standings look now, Fiesta would be choosing from BYU, Virginia Tech, Boise, and Cincinnati and Pitt to play either Penn State or Iowa.

If I’m the Fiesta Bowl, I don’t see how Iowa vs. BYU, Iowa vs. Boise, Iowa vs. Virginia Tech, or Iowa vs. Cincinnati could be more compelling than Pitt vs. Penn State.

There are plenty of teams out there that I’m sure people would rather see Penn State play in a bowl game, but right now, they’re not eligible.

God Created the World Out Of Nothing, Paterno Built A National Superpower On Cow Fields...

by Adam Bittner on Nov 29, 2009 9:10 PM EST reply actions  

Sigh, I really, really don't see it myself.

But there’s a long way to go, and it’s silly to continue to argue this. I’ll tell you what, you have made me care about the outcome of this game a tiny bit. If you believe it so intently, then maybe there’s some truth and I have to root for Cincy. There is no value to playing Pitt. It would be immensely more valuable and rewarding to play LSU. So I hope your fanshot was spot on, and they’re all about Iowa.

by PSUinBOSSton on Nov 29, 2009 9:14 PM EST up reply actions  

So you're saying I'm right

You just don’t want it to happen?

Ok, I can accept that, despite the fact I disagree with that as well. Pitt’s pulled in some decent recruits from our “territory” since the ‘stache showed up, and it’d go a long way in crushing Dave’s “wall” around the WPIAL, the most fertile recruiting ground in our state. There is a benefit to playing them that I think far outweighs whatever boost we’d get from playing LSU

God Created the World Out Of Nothing, Paterno Built A National Superpower On Cow Fields...

by Adam Bittner on Nov 29, 2009 9:24 PM EST up reply actions  

Haha, nice try, no.

I’m saying that if Fiesta favors Iowa even a fraction, Pitt being available will not change that. They will still pick Iowa. If they want Penn State, they will pick Penn State.

We have already blown Wann whatever’s wall out of the water this year. We are getting Pitt legacy’s children who live in the area.

Playing LSU gets us more eyeballs, which is more exposure. A win would be more highly regarded reputation wise, and a loss would be explained away more easily. Pitt cuts against all of those things.

by PSUinBOSSton on Nov 29, 2009 9:29 PM EST up reply actions  

No

It’s a package deal. You act like Iowa or Penn State would be the only team playing in the game. It’s about making the best matchup, and I sincerely doubt that any Fiesta Bowl rep believes Iowa vs. Pitt would be more marketable than Penn State vs. Pitt and that’s all that matters in this specific scenario.

Maybe Iowa is more attractive to them in a vaccuum, but with Pitt in the picture I think the edge has to go to Penn State. Not only would they we be a great draw on our own, but we’d get the absolute most out of the Pitt. They’d fill their seats, and anyone who’s ever even been a casual Pitt fan will watch the entire game.

Nationally, a lot of people would probably say “hey, that used to be a pretty good rivalry”, and tune in. Will they look at it like UM-OSU or Florida-Georgia? Hellzzzzz no. But it’s intriguing, and far more so that PSU or Iowa vs. any of the other teams on the board.

God Created the World Out Of Nothing, Paterno Built A National Superpower On Cow Fields...

by Adam Bittner on Nov 29, 2009 9:48 PM EST up reply actions  

Well

First, I totally and unequivocally disagree with you on the national perception. No way. No one outside of the region and old enough to remember a competitive game would care enough to tune in. They would probably be less likely than to watch a game with an underdog that could upset a BCS conference team. That’s my opinion, it’s informed by the fact that I grew up outside the PSU footprint and am mostly surrounded with more casual fans, which I believe to be more abundant.

I also disagree about Pitt fans selling out their seats plus. They’d fill their seats? Based on what?

If they want Iowa, they’re taking Iowa. No amount Pitt availability, or any other team, is changing that.

by PSUinBOSSton on Nov 29, 2009 9:56 PM EST up reply actions  

Everyone likes a grudge match

Iowa vs ? has no history.

"The name on the front of the jersey is what really matters, not the name on the back" --Joe Paterno

by JuniataMan on Nov 29, 2009 10:02 PM EST up reply actions  

If Georgia and Ga Tech stopped playing,

and played in the BCS 10 years from now, would you tune in? I wouldn’t. Unless there was something more compelling involved.

by PSUinBOSSton on Nov 29, 2009 10:06 PM EST up reply actions  

Yes

I watched it last night, and I enjoyed it. I enjoy the passion. I enjoy the tradition. I enjoy the history. Rivalry games are the best things in sports, no matter where they’re played in relation to where I grew up.

God Created the World Out Of Nothing, Paterno Built A National Superpower On Cow Fields...

by Adam Bittner on Nov 29, 2009 10:07 PM EST up reply actions  

Geez

Playing Penn State would be Pitt’s Super Bowl. That’s why we don’t play them in the regular season in the first place. The game means a metric assload more to them than it ever would to us, and that’s just the point. If they’d pack Heinz Field for a meaningless September non-con game, they’d sure as hell do it for a BCS bowl. Would they for Iowa? No.

And I’m not sure TCU and Boise are exactly the “underdogs” you’re looking for, nor are Penn State and Iowa the goliaths. Hell, both Boise and TCU will be ranked ahead of either Penn State or Iowa.

Look, I could see your point under just about any other set of circumstances, but this is about PSU vs. Pitt or Iowa vs. Pitt, and if that’s the choice Fiesta has to make, they’d be out of their minds to pick Iowa for the old Hawkeye alums living in Arizona.

God Created the World Out Of Nothing, Paterno Built A National Superpower On Cow Fields...

by Adam Bittner on Nov 29, 2009 10:06 PM EST up reply actions  

No, it's really not about that.

It’s about PSU vs Iowa, as a selection.

Are you really so sure that people within a few miles who pack Heinz will go to Arizona? It’s a very different thing.

And regardless of what you, the informed CFB fan thinks, the casual fan or the out of region fan does view it as a David v. Goliath scenario.

by PSUinBOSSton on Nov 29, 2009 10:10 PM EST up reply actions  

Well I know one thing

They wouldn’t pack it for Iowa. They didn’t even fill Heinz for Iowa. Attendance was 50,011, last year, or 15,000 below Heinz Field capacity.

By comparison, they broke the Heinz Field attendance record (including Steeler games) for the Notre Dame game this year.

Can I promise they’d fill their seats? No, but I can promise that they’d fill more for us than for Iowa.

God Created the World Out Of Nothing, Paterno Built A National Superpower On Cow Fields...

by Adam Bittner on Nov 29, 2009 10:13 PM EST up reply actions  

Notre Dame

They’d of course be a comparable rival to us from Pitt’s perspective.

God Created the World Out Of Nothing, Paterno Built A National Superpower On Cow Fields...

by Adam Bittner on Nov 29, 2009 10:14 PM EST up reply actions  

It's a huge leap to go from, fill Heinz field to fill a stadium in Arizona.

Also, as I’ve said. They won’t think about Iowa v Pitt, because Pitt would go to the Sugar.

by PSUinBOSSton on Nov 29, 2009 10:17 PM EST up reply actions  

Who plays Iowa then?

Boise, Cincinnati, BYU, or Virginia Tech. Snoozerville.

God Created the World Out Of Nothing, Paterno Built A National Superpower On Cow Fields...

by Adam Bittner on Nov 29, 2009 10:20 PM EST up reply actions  

Snoozerville to you, because you for some reason want to see them play.

How does your opinion change if Clemson wins? That pretty much eliminates the TCU to Orange scenario. Would you still think the Fiesta would take us even if they like Iowa better, and hope Pitt goes to the Fiesta? Just curious.

by PSUinBOSSton on Nov 29, 2009 10:27 PM EST up reply actions  

Iowa vs. TCU

It’s questionable. For as good as TCU is, I have yet to see them play, and I think that’d be true of most people. It’s a double edged sword. Would people watch to see what TCU is all about? Or would they not care because they’re invisible? Probably a bit of both.

Overall, I think it’d be more interesting from a football perspective, and even if it wasn’t AS marketable as Pitt-Penn State, I think Fiesta would go with it anyway because they like Iowa so much.

God Created the World Out Of Nothing, Paterno Built A National Superpower On Cow Fields...

by Adam Bittner on Nov 29, 2009 10:30 PM EST up reply actions  

Does that matter if either Iowa fills it anyway?

Because that’s the reason people believe Iowa has the edge.

by PSUinBOSSton on Nov 29, 2009 10:16 PM EST up reply actions  

Well who knows

Iowa is probably a better draw in stadium, and we’re probably a better draw TV wise. If Pitt’s in the picture, though, I think the stadium aspect becomes moot, because it’d going to be full either way and it comes down to TV where PSU vs. Pitt is by far more attractive.

God Created the World Out Of Nothing, Paterno Built A National Superpower On Cow Fields...

by Adam Bittner on Nov 29, 2009 10:22 PM EST up reply actions  

PSU v Pitt is really not "by far more attractive."

You are way, way overestimating the number of people who care whether they play.

by PSUinBOSSton on Nov 29, 2009 10:25 PM EST up reply actions  

Maybe I am

But whatever overestimation I’m making, you’ve got me beat beacuse absolutely no one would care about Pitt vs. Iowa. Not Iowa, not Pitt, and definitely not the nation as a whole.

God Created the World Out Of Nothing, Paterno Built A National Superpower On Cow Fields...

by Adam Bittner on Nov 29, 2009 10:27 PM EST up reply actions  

Ok

Well then I’m going to assume you think they’d play Boise then who has less of a following and less of a TV audience than Pitt.

God Created the World Out Of Nothing, Paterno Built A National Superpower On Cow Fields...

by Adam Bittner on Nov 29, 2009 10:33 PM EST up reply actions  

Boise or a 3 loss team X.

Depending who is in the top 14 when available. Where are you getting less of a tv audience than Pitt? Even if that’s true, I don’t think it’s a very substantial margin. Not enough to get them to tip the balance away from Iowa, if they’re leaning that way.

by PSUinBOSSton on Nov 29, 2009 10:38 PM EST up reply actions  

Well let's compare

In 2008…

Outback Bowl (Iowa), drew 3.10.
Sun (Pitt) drew 2.20

It’s important to note that Pitt’s game was New Year’s eve, probably one of the worst nights in the bowl season, while Iowa’s was New Year’s Day, typically considered the best day of the bowl season.

Other teams:
Poinsettia (TCU vs. Boise) drew a 3.70.
Las Vegas (BYU) drew 2.50.
Fiesta (Cincinnati vs. VT) drew a 5.40
Emerald (Miami) drew a 4.60.

Overall, I think Pitt did fairly well against it’s opponents considering the circumstances surrounding their game. None of these teams were much of a draw last season, and there’s no reason to think this year would be any different.

Put Pitt in a game against Penn State, though, and I think it separates them from the pack.

God Created the World Out Of Nothing, Paterno Built A National Superpower On Cow Fields...

by Adam Bittner on Nov 29, 2009 10:47 PM EST up reply actions  

Correction

Cincy-VT was Orange

God Created the World Out Of Nothing, Paterno Built A National Superpower On Cow Fields...

by Adam Bittner on Nov 29, 2009 10:47 PM EST up reply actions  

2.2 to 3.1 is significant.

In fact, looking at that Orange rating, in which the Cincy ticket sales were considered a disaster, I am even more convinced that Va Tech would be taken before a big east team.

by PSUinBOSSton on Nov 29, 2009 11:00 PM EST up reply actions  

OK

The question now becomes if you think the Big East is more marketable than even the C-USA or MAC. It seems you couldn’t have a lower opinion of the league than seems possible to me. They didn’t get their BCS bid by sucking THAT hard.

Granted, this was before most of the schools in the league today showed up, and before BC, VT, and Miami left, but Pitt was in that group, too don’t forget.

God Created the World Out Of Nothing, Paterno Built A National Superpower On Cow Fields...

by Adam Bittner on Nov 29, 2009 11:16 PM EST up reply actions  

I don't see what the CUSA and MAC have to do with anything.

Your update though, combined with that insane 4.6 for the Emerald bowl is intriguing. That’s got to be well over 6 million households, maybe close to 7. I don’t think they travel all too well, but they could be attractive to the Orange if Clemson wins the ACC.

All disagreements aside, if I haven’t said it Fugi, really excellent post. Really keeping me going during this lull.

by PSUinBOSSton on Nov 30, 2009 10:24 AM EST up reply actions  

Also,

if Pitt is as marketable as you say, then they wouldn’t pick PSU based on speculation of a good matchup because Pitt could go to the Orange.

by PSUinBOSSton on Nov 29, 2009 10:24 PM EST up reply actions  

They could

I have a source in the Pitt band who told me an Orange Scout told the Pitt band director they really like Pitt, probably because they aren’t Cincinnati. But I don’t know whether they like them MORE than TCU.

God Created the World Out Of Nothing, Paterno Built A National Superpower On Cow Fields...

by Adam Bittner on Nov 29, 2009 10:37 PM EST up reply actions  

If that's true, then it supports my point that the pick best team available,

and don’t speculate matchups. Also, I don’t trust what bowl “scouts” say to band directors. I’ll give you this, if it weren’t such a crappy year of mediocrity, we wouldn’t be having this conversation at all.

by PSUinBOSSton on Nov 29, 2009 10:40 PM EST up reply actions  

Disagree they would still pick Iowa

They have to look at the matchup that will produce the most viewers in addition to the individual teams

"The name on the front of the jersey is what really matters, not the name on the back" --Joe Paterno

by JuniataMan on Nov 29, 2009 9:49 PM EST up reply actions  

And how does Pitt vs. Iowa do that?

God Created the World Out Of Nothing, Paterno Built A National Superpower On Cow Fields...

by Adam Bittner on Nov 29, 2009 9:51 PM EST up reply actions  

PSU vs Pitt

This matchup would outdraw any Iowa vs (any eligible team). So even if the Fiesta bowl folks gave Iowa an edge over PSU, if the opponent is Pitt, they would have to go with PSU.

"The name on the front of the jersey is what really matters, not the name on the back" --Joe Paterno

by JuniataMan on Nov 29, 2009 9:54 PM EST up reply actions  

O yeah, then we agree

It’s just nonsense to think Iowa vs. Pitt is more marketable than PSU vs. Pitt.

God Created the World Out Of Nothing, Paterno Built A National Superpower On Cow Fields...

by Adam Bittner on Nov 29, 2009 9:55 PM EST up reply actions  

I'll give you this

I don’t want it to come down to the Fiesta Bowl if we can avoid it. If it means anything, I voted for Oregon losing in the poll because I think the Orange is our best chance. But, if it comes down to Fiesta, I’ll be hoping Pitt is on the board, because otherwise I think we’re screwed.

God Created the World Out Of Nothing, Paterno Built A National Superpower On Cow Fields...

by Adam Bittner on Nov 29, 2009 9:54 PM EST up reply actions  

I kinda would be nice

to smash PITT one more time and them say this is why we pick playing Eastern Illionois over you

"No, Donny, these men are nihilists. There's nothing to be afraid of"

by psu in the w-b on Nov 29, 2009 9:17 PM EST up reply actions  

Also, come on, "national tier."

They play during the week how many times when 0 other games are on? And when they play on saturdays, national tier could mean the game is on espn but it still only reaches jesse. and his neighbors dog.

by PSUinBOSSton on Nov 29, 2009 9:24 PM EST up reply actions  

Only two of those were Friday night

and the WVU game is a traditional Black Friday thing so…

God Created the World Out Of Nothing, Paterno Built A National Superpower On Cow Fields...

by Adam Bittner on Nov 29, 2009 9:26 PM EST up reply actions  

Question, for you both

How would you describe the phenomenon oft-cited in blogistan, ‘National Perception?’ What form does this take? And who are the protagonists: MSM television (WWL?), MSM print (big regional paper columnists or big internet sites (WWL?, CBS?, SI?)), or Blogistani regional members (South, Midwest or West bloggers?)

Any eloquence you can give to the notion is appreciated in advance.

"For me the game wasn’t grounded in reality. It was about the uniform you put on that turned you into a warrior. It was about the mythology of the battle, the victory, the defeat, the struggle." - Mike Reid, PSU '69

by jtothep on Nov 30, 2009 8:49 AM EST up reply actions  

He’s counting ESPNU as “national” which is true, but misleading since most households don’t have the channel. The BTN is just as “national” by that criteria (those two channels are in a similar number of homes).

by Laaaaazzz on Nov 30, 2009 10:19 AM EST up reply actions  

-1 to you sir

We all know that.

God Created the World Out Of Nothing, Paterno Built A National Superpower On Cow Fields...

by Adam Bittner on Nov 29, 2009 10:08 PM EST up reply actions  

Because I've gone crazy

I’m adding a new scenario, and one that makes a few large assumptions. Lets assume Texas, Oregon, Cincy, and Clemson win their respective conferences next week. Now for the big assumptions:

1st – The bowls are willing to overlook Boise State and their undefeated season in order to get a better selling match-up.
2nd – The loss by Georgia Tech slides them out of the top 14 in the BCS. With the #15 and #16 teams losing (Pitt and Oregon State), SWAG U slides into the top 14. I hope you’ve now guessed where I’m going with this….
3rd – The Orange Bowl agrees to take TCU or Cincy, because they’ll be getting an undefeated team. Ok, it’s really just for argument’s sake, but I was trying to find a reason.

This would be the bowl breakdown:

MNC: Texas vs. Florida/Alabama
Rose: Oregon vs. Ohio State
Fiesta: Iowa/Penn State vs. Miami (FL)
Orange: Clemson vs. TCU/Cincy
Sugar: Alabama/Florida vs. TCU/Cincy

A certain “rematch” in the Fiesta Bowl? Why not?

"In the beginning the Universe was created.
This has made a lot of people very angry and been widely regarded as a bad move."

by IcersGuy on Nov 29, 2009 11:51 PM EST reply actions  

Eh

It’s not really that unreasonable.

"I don't know. I don't know. [waves hand dismissively] First, you'd have to tell me what a 'BCS' is. I don't know."

by ReadingRambler on Nov 29, 2009 11:59 PM EST up reply actions  

Well

If I was PSUinBOSSton I’d tell you “no, no, no”, but I agree with you, I think it helps us to have teams we have a history against in the mix. I think it’s the only way we have a chance of being selected ahead of Iowa in the Fiesta.

God Created the World Out Of Nothing, Paterno Built A National Superpower On Cow Fields...

by Adam Bittner on Nov 30, 2009 12:00 AM EST up reply actions  

Because that scenario and USC win over Arizona likely puts USC in the top 14...

… and while the Trojans may or may not travel poorly by Big Ten standards, they ain’t Boise (or Miami). Really. They’re #18 now, the computers love them, and with three teams not far ahead of them losing (Oregon State, Pitt, GT) and a win over a decent Arizona team, they ought to jump a team with the same record (Miami) and a two-loss mid-major (BYU) as well.

What you probably get is

MNC: Texas vs. Floribama
Rose: Oregon vs. Ohio State
Orange: Clemson vs. USC
Sugar: Floribama the lesser vs. Cinci
Fiesta: PSU/Iowa vs. TCU

by drothgery on Nov 30, 2009 10:57 AM EST up reply actions  

Well now you're adding a 4th assumption

that USC beats Arizona. The statistical rankings don’t have a big difference between USC and Miami, and I’m going to use the “poll inertia” card that says that USC beating an unranked Arizona team won’t magically occur in voters jumping USC ahead of idle teams. So I’m not sure that USC would jump. Then again, I’m not certain that GT falls out of the top 14 with a loss to Clemson.

Either way, it all just adds to the insanity. Speaking of which, thanks Fugi for adding my insanity to the main post. I think it’s a proper cap to how most of us are feeling about this process right now.

"In the beginning the Universe was created.
This has made a lot of people very angry and been widely regarded as a bad move."

by IcersGuy on Nov 30, 2009 11:48 AM EST up reply actions  

This is pissing me off

I don’t care, but I can’t even say “wait till after the Michigan State game” anymore.

This sucks.

"I don't know. I don't know. [waves hand dismissively] First, you'd have to tell me what a 'BCS' is. I don't know."

by ReadingRambler on Nov 29, 2009 11:53 PM EST reply actions  

Another week of this?

Crap

"I don't know. I don't know. [waves hand dismissively] First, you'd have to tell me what a 'BCS' is. I don't know."

by ReadingRambler on Nov 29, 2009 11:58 PM EST up reply actions  

We have bball tomorrow night

God Created the World Out Of Nothing, Paterno Built A National Superpower On Cow Fields...

by Adam Bittner on Nov 30, 2009 12:02 AM EST up reply actions  

I forgot about that

Death to Cavaliers. Those doucheas wear suits to football games! SUITS! AT FOOTBALL GAMES!

"I don't know. I don't know. [waves hand dismissively] First, you'd have to tell me what a 'BCS' is. I don't know."

by ReadingRambler on Nov 30, 2009 12:03 AM EST up reply actions  

Whole suits?

or just shirts and ties. And if just shirts and ties aren’t allowed to football games, how long have you hated Joe Paterno?

by jimbo2psu on Nov 30, 2009 11:23 AM EST up reply actions  

I saw some with both

Yeah, yeah, JoePa, but, I don’t know, it reeks of snobbishness. “We suck, but our degree is so much better.”

"I don't know. I don't know. [waves hand dismissively] First, you'd have to tell me what a 'BCS' is. I don't know."

by ReadingRambler on Nov 30, 2009 11:58 AM EST up reply actions  

The suits are classy. Shows they are prefessional

"No, Donny, these men are nihilists. There's nothing to be afraid of"

by psu in the w-b on Nov 30, 2009 6:06 PM EST up reply actions  

Can we have a HATE WEEK post for the BCS?

I think that would help ease the pain of all this speculative BS.

by dawsonPSU10 on Dec 1, 2009 12:05 PM EST up reply actions  

My new thing

now that I’m back from way too many hours in the car:

Every realistic spot (Fiesta, Orange and Cap1) has us paired with a team I don’t have any special love for. I’m over the “prestige” of a BCS bid, mostly becuase it doesn’t mean anything anymore, and right now it’s coming down to this: I don’t want to have to go to work the day after the game, and I’d prefer to not have to work the day of.

Therefore more order goes: Orange (Friday night), Cap1 (NYD), Fiesta (Thursday night).

BSD

by KevinHD on Nov 30, 2009 9:23 AM EST reply actions  

This kind of stuff is why I don't get into FF

I don’t have the time or energy to worry about projections and scenarios. Can we just play the games already? At this point I’d take the Alamo Bowl as long as I see Penn State in an actual game.

by RNF18 on Nov 30, 2009 9:28 AM EST reply actions  

I hate the Alamo Bowl. They need more lights in there.

BSD

by KevinHD on Nov 30, 2009 9:31 AM EST up reply actions  

I would actually like the Alamo Bowl this year

Since Oklahoma will probably be involved.

"I don't know. I don't know. [waves hand dismissively] First, you'd have to tell me what a 'BCS' is. I don't know."

by ReadingRambler on Nov 30, 2009 9:54 AM EST up reply actions  

If Oregon loses, they'll be ranked higher than #14 in the BCS

and thus won’t be eligible for a BCS bowl.

I’d like for PSU to go to a BCS game because, I believe, we split any bowl revenue with the BXI, that is PSU gets 50% and the other 50% is split among the other ten schoools. (Please correct me if I’m wrong about this.)

Finally, please stop insisting that Pitt-PSU is really, really important. If I want blantant burgh homerism, I go to the post gazette. Not BSD.

I wouldn't trust old rooster me neither.

by spakajewia on Nov 30, 2009 10:50 AM EST reply actions  

(Please correct me if I’m wrong about this.)

You’re wrong about this. Penn State gets “travel” costs, which is a bit more than actual expenses, but still completely meaningless when taken in context of total bowl revenue. For all practical purposes, it’s fair to say that bowl money is in fact split evenly between all the Big Ten teams.

BSD

by KevinHD on Nov 30, 2009 11:08 AM EST up reply actions  

That is my understanding as well. Making the BCS versus going to the Cap One Bowl is essentially meaningless for PSU from a financial standpoint due to Big Ten revenue sharing.

The benefit to going to the BCS for PSU would be in terms of prestige/exposure/hype. Being able to say “went to 2 straight BCS bowls” or “went to 3 BCS bowls in the past 5 years”, etc.

by Laaaaazzz on Nov 30, 2009 11:47 AM EST up reply actions  

thanks

did some googling to confirm…it looks like the “travel costs” allocated for orange/sugar are about $300k more than for cap one/alamo, but in the grand scheme of things, that’s chump change.

I wouldn't trust old rooster me neither.

by spakajewia on Nov 30, 2009 11:55 AM EST up reply actions  

"Really really important?"

Never said that.

But it’s an interesting angle that gives Penn State at least a shot.

God Created the World Out Of Nothing, Paterno Built A National Superpower On Cow Fields...

by Adam Bittner on Nov 30, 2009 12:36 PM EST up reply actions  

even if you never said it

relentlessly advocating its relative importance in dozens of comments implies that you think its “really, really important.”

I wouldn't trust old rooster me neither.

by spakajewia on Nov 30, 2009 12:50 PM EST up reply actions  

For Penn State's chances?

Yes, yes I do think it’s really important. I don’t think Fiesta has a compelling reason to pick Penn State over Iowa right now, but the prospect of Pitt vs. Penn State in a major bowl game is compelling and could put us over the top.

I think me and Boston have been arguing more about how compelling it would be, and how it would help Penn State’s BCS chances than anything else.

But in terms of simply playing Pitt, I could give two craps less.

God Created the World Out Of Nothing, Paterno Built A National Superpower On Cow Fields...

by Adam Bittner on Nov 30, 2009 1:06 PM EST up reply actions  

But in terms of simply playing Pitt, I could give two craps less.

I don’t believe you.

"I don't know. I don't know. [waves hand dismissively] First, you'd have to tell me what a 'BCS' is. I don't know."

by ReadingRambler on Nov 30, 2009 2:55 PM EST up reply actions  

No trust me

I’m with the whole “Let’s not play them” thing.

It’s BS that we’d basically sell out their stadium for them and give them a boost that they can’t reciprocate.

If they can keep it up, maybe we can give them one home and home like everyone else (Syracuse, Rutgers, etc.) but making them a staple on the schedule would be stupid. We wouldn’t be able to schedule home-and-homes with anyone else, including Miami, Nebraska, and Alabama, and I’d much rather have those games instead of an indefinite Pitt series.

God Created the World Out Of Nothing, Paterno Built A National Superpower On Cow Fields...

by Adam Bittner on Nov 30, 2009 4:27 PM EST up reply actions  

I still don't believe you

"I don't know. I don't know. [waves hand dismissively] First, you'd have to tell me what a 'BCS' is. I don't know."

by ReadingRambler on Nov 30, 2009 5:04 PM EST up reply actions  

"if they cna keep it up, maybe we can give them one home and home like everyone else (Syracuse, Rutgers, etc.)

because we know how well that worked with Syracuse…and Rutgers will probably be terrible again when we play them. Same with Pitt if this were to happen, as this would require them to have a few good years, and then a few years before we play. Does anyone seriously think Pitt can sustain good football for the greater part of a decade?

by The JuggerNitt on Nov 30, 2009 6:55 PM EST up reply actions  

I don’t think Fiesta has a compelling reason to pick Penn State over Iowa right now

You mean other than a larger fan base and better TV ratings? Or not losing 2 of 3 games at the end of the season?

by Laaaaazzz on Nov 30, 2009 1:45 PM EST reply actions  

The former is arguable, and the latter is a function of schedule more than anything else (both of you had losses to OSU in the final three and wins over a 6-6 team; Iowa lost to Northwestern without their starting QB while you beat Indiana). Neither is really “compelling”.

by SpartanDan on Dec 1, 2009 12:42 AM EST up reply actions  

In reality, no...however we know the BCS doesn't function in reality.

On paper, they lost 2 of 3. The last image they have of PSU is them running roughshod over MSU. Frankly none of this matters and this discussion is played out. I think the point is that this is a toss-up. Coin-flip. whatever. Fair or deserving mean nothing. Iowa deserves it yeah, but that doesn’t matter. It doesn’t matter that they didn’t have their starting QB.

2 years ago Kansas got picked over a Mizzou squad that they lost to. Last year Iowa got bumped in the bowl order over a same record jNW squad who they lost to.

laaaazzzz is just pointing out what PSU may have going in its favor. Luckily for Iowa they have a very good and well travelled fan base, so they likely get the nod. However they do lose the “name” test and many times the name carries the day.

Black Shoes. Basic Blues. No Name. All Game.

"Everyone has a plan, until they get punched in the mouth."

by Roland86 on Dec 1, 2009 2:57 AM EST up reply actions  

Next Sunday can’t get here soon enough.

by catesinator on Nov 30, 2009 3:59 PM EST reply actions  

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