No Ohio State, You Don't Get To Take Credit For This
by KevinHD on Dec 3, 2009 9:30 AM EST
in Basketball
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Ohio State had the last game on the last day of the Big Ten-ACC Challenge last night. And when they won their favorable matchup, predictability ensued:
Threebler Leads OSU, Big Ten to Challege Victory
After 10 years of heartburn, the Big Ten finally broke through in the ACC/BigTen Challenge thanks largely to Jon Diebler's sniper skills as the Buckeyes defeated Florida State 77-64 tonight in the Schott giving the conference a 6-5 series win.
I understand that, yes, the Buckeyes win meant the Big Ten won the fake challenge. But winning a game at home in which you were seven-point favorites does not make you the hero, even if you are Ohio State.
The credit here goes to Wisconsin. Unranked but at home, they jumped to an energetic early lead on #5 Duke and never looked back.
The Big Ten-ACC thing has always been difficult because Duke and North Carolina are usually major trump cards for the other side. Add in up-and-down schools like Maryland and Clemson, and it's hard to win the majority of the games starting in what is effectively an 0-4 hole. Wisconsin helped change that and it seems to have made the difference.
So we can all move on now, with the losing streak over, in a challenge that draws ratings but I don't agree really matters:
This is not some company shill. Sure, ESPN's family of networks has been a major player in the event over the past 10 years, helping coordinate matchups with the respective conferences.
But the concept dominates the sport early this week because it creates interest at every school in two high-profile conferences.
So yes, it was watched, but does that mean it matters? When Notre Dame and Michigan faced off in last year's LOL Bowl, everyone watched. But you'd be hard pressed to argue it mattered.
In fact, historically the Challenge might have been doing way more harm than good.
"So I think too much emphasis is placed on who wins the Challenge," Carmody said. "But I think it's a great opportunity to show off the strength of our leagues. It's a great barometer for your team, but at the same time it's only as significant as us beating Iowa State or Notre Dame."
So if anything, at least this thing allows us to make more backhanded comments at Notre Dame.
Update: And Rambler has your game-by-game review, complete with [redacted] photoshops and this map:
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Big Ten/ACC Challenge
I always thought it to be an interesting concept, but whished it rotated among conferences. I would like to see a Big Ten/Big East Challenge and/or a Big East/ACC Challenge, etc…
Never mistake effort for achievement.
Wisko deserves most of the credit
illinois deserves the rest for coming back and winning on the road vs a ranked Clemson. Ohio State was supposed to win — and they did. Big friggin deal. I’m sure they’ll be putting it on t-shirts in Columbus either way.
"We hugged as grown men do. It was a great moment. Then, it was business as usual." -- LJ Sr.
Well
It’s not like the winner gets a trophy or anything. But it’s a fun challenge for the fans of the two conferences. And it will certainly help the RPI if the Big Ten schools. I wish college sports did more stuff like this. The PAC-10 and Big XII are starting their own challenge this year. I’d love to see the Big Ten do something similar in football.
Mike
Black Shoe Diaries
You mean like the annual
Big 10-ND challenge?
Fun fact
Notre Dame refuses to play Purdue in basketball because “Notre Dame basketball is a national program and Purdue isn’t” or some BS like that.
Doesn’t matter that, you know, Purdue is currently the best program in the state…
"I don't know. I don't know. [waves hand dismissively] First, you'd have to tell me what a 'BCS' is. I don't know."
by ReadingRambler on Dec 3, 2009 9:50 AM EST up reply actions
It’s certainly more fun than more games against Robert Morris.
If anything is forces schools to actually play somebody instead of pulling a 2009 PSU football schedule every couple of years to pad the budget.
I mean I watched, but in a strange way the fun thing for me was how uncompetitive it was. The BT never having won it was what made me interested.
BSD
I believe there were 4 or 5 Challenges determined by a single game
Including a near buzzer beater by Illinois last year. So it wasn’t as though the ACC utterly owned us, but it’s nice that we can say that with full confidence now.
And, um, don’t tell anyone this, but the conference will be better next year. Maybe even Northwestern included.
"I don't know. I don't know. [waves hand dismissively] First, you'd have to tell me what a 'BCS' is. I don't know."
by ReadingRambler on Dec 3, 2009 9:53 AM EST up reply actions
I think it was very important this year
Expectations were so high for the Big Ten this year, and after the debacle last weekend you could see the media was writing up their Big Ten sucks articles.
"I don't know. I don't know. [waves hand dismissively] First, you'd have to tell me what a 'BCS' is. I don't know."
by ReadingRambler on Dec 3, 2009 9:51 AM EST up reply actions
But, but
I think we could really use a Michigan State victory over Texas later this month. I have my doubts as Dexter Pittman and Damion James are probably going to dominate inside, but we really could use a marquee win. Would also help if Purdue beats WVU.
"I don't know. I don't know. [waves hand dismissively] First, you'd have to tell me what a 'BCS' is. I don't know."
by ReadingRambler on Dec 3, 2009 10:02 AM EST up reply actions
I wish college sports did more stuff like this. The PAC-10 and Big XII are starting their own challenge this year.
The Big 12/Pac 10 Hardwood Series (set up in a similar way as the ACC/Big Ten one) has been going on since 2007. It’s spread out over a few weeks though and not carried entirely on ESPN, so it doesn’t get the same kind of coverage.
There’s also the SEC/Big East Invitational also started in 2007. But all it is is 4 games per year, with 2 doubleheaders at non-campus sites. Seems to me to be kind of silly.
I think the Mountain West and Missouri Valley also do something.
that espn story mentions
Why are commissioners in the West Coast Conference and the Atlantic 10 about to lock in on a challenge for 2010 and beyond?
BSD
Trophy
Actually, Mike, I think there’s a “commissioner’s trophy” or some such nonsense that gets doled out.
Amen to the points above though giving credit to the undead Bo Ryan and his band of merry white gentlemen.
[insert prophetic yet obnoxiously haughty and annoying quote here]
I thought Bo Ryan was
going to jump out of my TV several times to devour my soul, I immediately diverted my eyes. Close calls.
One man doing the work of 100's for the good of 1000's
Terrelle Pryor photoshop?
What? You mean the Talor Battle photoshop?
"I don't know. I don't know. [waves hand dismissively] First, you'd have to tell me what a 'BCS' is. I don't know."
The challenge
offers interesting intersectional matchups that are almost all on national TV. Can’t really find much to criticize about that. So, it matters in that sense. Plus, it increases the validity of RPI ratings by giving a whole host of cross-comparisons between two major conferences.
I don't think it's all bad
but:
(1) losing the Challenge, which the BT has done very year, probably gets a disproportionate amount of air time from pendents during tourny selection.
(2) the BT usually loses more games than it wins, thus hurting everyone’s RPI.
(3) I still haven’t talked to anyone who is really proud of winning the Challenge. People from the SEC will do things like this, I don’t feel that same level of togetherness from the BT. In fact I’d argue the more successful the league is, the less we care about each other.
But yeah, it’s certainly more fun than the alternative, which is a bunch of BT v mid-major games.
BSD
I'm proud if winning it
But only because we contributed.
First Big Ten team to win a 3 in a row, woo.
"I don't know. I don't know. [waves hand dismissively] First, you'd have to tell me what a 'BCS' is. I don't know."
by ReadingRambler on Dec 3, 2009 11:02 AM EST up reply actions
I watched a little of the OSU game and had to turn it off
It was a painful game to watch. The Wiscy game however had my full attention. Glad the Big Ten won. Hopefully it’ll help PSU this year when the bids come out if we’re in contention for the tournament.
Is it really going to matter?
I mean the Va win was great, but I thought we realized like two weeks ago the tourny is a highly unrealistic goal right now.
BSD
It still helps
Winning this thing a) boosts RPI for the conference, b) boosts the reputation of the conference), and c) will probably give Big Ten teams better seeds come tourney time (For example, I see Wisconsin as Sweet Sixteen as of now).
All of this leads to more respect this time next year, which can only help our goal of reaching the tournament next year.
"I don't know. I don't know. [waves hand dismissively] First, you'd have to tell me what a 'BCS' is. I don't know."
by ReadingRambler on Dec 3, 2009 11:37 AM EST up reply actions
Um, ok
"I don't know. I don't know. [waves hand dismissively] First, you'd have to tell me what a 'BCS' is. I don't know."
by ReadingRambler on Dec 3, 2009 12:24 PM EST up reply actions
Why not?
Last we our OOC record was 11-2 and this year it could be 10-2. Our schedule is tougher this year and potential wins against Temple, UVA, and VaTech should look nicer to a committee than last year’s OOC W’s.
I think we’ve got a younger team on our hands but I think the upside for this team is greater than last year’s upside. I don’t think that those 2 early losses tell us who we’ll be as a team once we get into conference play. I’m in wait and see mode because I think we’ll get better as we go from here on in. Since the Big Ten is probably going to be stronger this year, that in combination with our performance last year in the NIT, I think might get us a nod for the tourney if we put ourself in the same situation as we did last year.
Those 2 early losses put more pressure on, though
I agree, I’m still in wait and see mode. But we have to sweep Temple and Vo Tech, and that’s quite a tall order. Otherwise we’re looking at 8-4 or 9-3 going into confernece play, and at that point we can probably only lose 3 or 4 conference games and still hope to make the tourney. And unless Babb learns how to shoot and Frazier learns how to play under control in a hurry, that’s not gonna happen.
For Michigan, that top 15 rankings seems so, so far away:
http://mgoblog.com/content/aaaaaarrrrrgggghhhh
"I don't know. I don't know. [waves hand dismissively] First, you'd have to tell me what a 'BCS' is. I don't know."
Can somebody explain to me
how the matchups are formed – and the home and away teams? I know there’s some effort to have pairings be as evenly matched as possible.
One man doing the work of 100's for the good of 1000's
I have no idea
But Bo Ryan doesn’t like it because he “had to push” to get them to schedule Wiscy-Duke.
"I don't know. I don't know. [waves hand dismissively] First, you'd have to tell me what a 'BCS' is. I don't know."
by ReadingRambler on Dec 3, 2009 12:55 PM EST up reply actions
The ACC team that finishes last the year before doesn’t participate (Ga Tech this season wasn’t part).
No team can be at home or on the road more than 2 seasons in a row. So, for example, PSU having played road games the past two seasons will be at home in 2010. They try to make it so that teams flip between home and away every year, but some teams go 2 in a row to work it out.
Beyond that, it’s pretty much ESPN setting the matchups to what they think is interesting. They probably try to make it fairly even so the games are competitive though.
Well, we own the ACC now so if ESPN knows what they're doing we'll play UNC or Duke next year
"I don't know. I don't know. [waves hand dismissively] First, you'd have to tell me what a 'BCS' is. I don't know."
by ReadingRambler on Dec 3, 2009 2:00 PM EST up reply actions
our tourney chances
So apparently RR and KHD have already written off the lions’ prospects for going to the tourney this year as “highly unrealistic.”
Is this fair? We’re 5-2, with the two losses being against UNC-Wilmington and Tulane in November. Since UNC-W is sometimes a very solid team (and may be one this year), its entirely plausible that the only bad loss so far is a 10:00 am November loss to an awful Tulane squad: big deal. Based on our record to date, we’re certainly not in or out; these things don’t get decided in November and December anyway.
So, I’m going to guess that RR, KHD, and the rest of the doubters just think that they play of the squad so far has been bad enough to surmise that we won’t have what it takes to get there come March. I haven’t seen enough of the team to make this judgment, but my sense is that “we’ve got a lot of talent, it’s just young and undisciplined.”
So what are you gonna do coach DeChellis?
I’m gonna break ’em down, and build ’em back up again.
I think DeChellis is a good coach and I think we do have the talent and the ability to get it all together. Are the odds that we dance in March good? Probably not. Unrealistic that we wear Cinderella’s slipper? Maybe. Highly unrealistic? absolutely not.
Remember Red, hope is a good thing, maybe the best of things, and no good thing ever dies.
I’m not writing off this team yet, not by a long shot. Talk to me about our tourney chances again in January. Let’s just improve and win some games.
I wouldn't trust old rooster me neither.
Then the hot chick gets depressed...
Because no guys ever talk to her.
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