Did You Feel That?
by Kevin HD on Mar 31, 2009 11:33 AM EDT
in Football
41 comments
A letter from mgoblog's mailbag (three letter emphasis mine):
What are the chances that Michigan will play one night game at home over the next 2-3 years? I would love to see Michigan Stadium all lit up for a home game v ND, MSU, or PSU. I don’t support the idea of playing "the Game" at night. Can you please tell me what your thoughts are on this subject.
Guess where this is going? Right, the tried and true rivalry dialog.
It's nothing groundbreaking or exciting, but there is a subtle enough shift happening here that it's probably worth pointing out. Penn State finally beat Ohio State and Michigan in the same season, won the conference championship for the second time in four years, and have recruited in a way that gives them (at least in theory) a shot at back to back auto-BSC bids.
And that's the ticket to filling the void.
Now, I don't know that I have a major issue with being rivalryless. Sure, it would be great, but in a lot of ways I kind of like how different opponents fill different roles on our schedule either year.
But whether I like it or not, winning causes power shifts, and statements like this one (control-b mine)...
"I don't think there's a kid on Ohio State who joined that roster not thinking about the opportunity to play Michigan," said Rick Pizzo, a studio host for the Big Ten Network. "I don't think that kids joined that roster thinking about the opportunity to play Penn State. Whether that will change in the future? Perhaps, but right now that's not the case."
...become somewhat fulfilling. I'm not arguing that Penn State will displace a tradition in a conference that get off on such history, but, as they say, winning solves a lot of problems. Rivalry fretters should keep that in mind.
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And I think it's kind of funny
Michigan fans are so egger for a night game. One or two are a good time but if I have to pre-game through another prime-time-fest like 2008 I’m going to renounce them forever.
Black Shoe Diaries
I BLAME IOWA.
by Kevin HD on Mar 31, 2009 12:01 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Not likely
We have been clamoring for a night game for years, and you can obviously see what has come of that. I think the best we can do for the foreseeable future is the occasional 3:30pm late fall game, like PSU in 2005. Maybe 10, 15 years from now, I could see a night game there, once the fan demographics have shifted (that’s a nice way of me saying once the blue hairs die off).
To give you an idea, they are spending 200MM+ renovating the stadium, and there won’t be any permanent lights added. Platforms, yes, but no lights.
by Wlvrn99 on Mar 31, 2009 12:35 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
But aren't lights used all the time for afternoon games?
I don’t quite understand why you wouldn’t just build those things in instead of hauling the stands and generators around every week.
Black Shoe Diaries
I BLAME IOWA.
by Kevin HD on Mar 31, 2009 12:41 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
No
No lights for 12 or 1 pm games. Only the late ones. And when I say lights, it is like 1 or 2 cranes with some big ass lights on them, so you wouldn’t want to play a whole game with them. The networks decide if they want to do a 3:30 game at Michigan, and part of the decision for them is the cost they incur on lighting/power/etc. If it were up to the UM Athletic Dept, every game would be at noon.
by Wlvrn99 on Mar 31, 2009 12:52 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Does UM want to keep
“The Big House” as invisible as possible? You don’t bury a giant stadium if you want it to be a focal point. Is the brass afraid that permanant lighting towers will make the buried bowl a little more obvious?
"You are a tenacious little monkey!"
by rahpsu92 on Mar 31, 2009 1:06 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Not sure I understand
Michigan Stadium is not intended to be a focal point in the sense of its visual presence within the skyline. In fact, there was some concern with the renovations that the towers would be too obtrusive. Not sure if you have ever been there but it is in a mostly residential area, nothing like Beaver Stadium.
by Wlvrn99 on Mar 31, 2009 1:11 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
That was my point...
the stadium currenltly has no presence and UM and the community want to keep it that way – thus no permanent light towers adding to the skyline.
"You are a tenacious little monkey!"
by rahpsu92 on Mar 31, 2009 2:29 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Good question....
Considering the lights are always on at Beaver, no matter what time the game starts.
Let's Go State
by rmcmillen50 on Mar 31, 2009 1:29 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I wasn't even alive for that game and I love watching that video.
I want to see PSU play them so much. Rivalries take time and eventually there will be even more hate between PSU, UM and OSU as long as PSU keeps winning.
Kath?
by psuphiman80 on Mar 31, 2009 12:04 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
God....
those graphics bring back memories. When you only had 3 channels to choose from you really really appreciated the opportuntity to watch a game like that.
That and I had to watch the Penn State recap show on Sunday mornings with Joe’s brother. I looked forward to that every weekend as well.
Also……….this Pizzo guy is off his rocker or really doesn’t have much to offer. I gurantee you an opportunity to play agains Paterno in Happy Valley is dangled out there to those recruits. More Michigan sure, but everybody wants to play in Happy Valley at night right now.
Eric Watters Atlanta, Ga.
"If you hear Ric Flair is in town......WHOOOOO........you KNOW things are takin' place".
Ric Flair
by ech2os on Mar 31, 2009 12:14 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
That comment took me a little off guard too
I think you go to OSU to win, because they’ve been doing that a lot lately, and you like the coaches/players/fans. But that linked story is easier to write when you find people who talk in absolutes.
Black Shoe Diaries
I BLAME IOWA.
by Kevin HD on Mar 31, 2009 12:38 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
George Paterno
Used to love his work. RIP George.
by jtothep on Mar 31, 2009 1:11 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Jackson's Catch
really is the best catch in PSU football history – all since are just imitators.
by PSUgirl on Mar 31, 2009 12:28 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
One may be better.
Bobby Engram’s one handed, behind his body, leaping, fully extended and parallel to the ground catch vs OSU in the 63-14 game.
by Cairo on Mar 31, 2009 12:35 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
what about Testaverde to Giftopoulos?
That one was pretty good, too ;-)
by The JuggerNitt on Mar 31, 2009 1:15 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
that one's good
but there’s just no comparison.
by PSUgirl on Mar 31, 2009 3:15 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I agree only b/c of the equipment
Can you imagine anyone at any position wearing shoulder pads that big these days? All those receivers and DBs are wearing pads wider than a Mack truck. Makes them look like they’re running in slow motion…
Blame Iowa!
by NittanyTide on Mar 31, 2009 1:35 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Well
The Garrity catch in the Sugar Bowl that season clinched the National Title.
And Ethan Kilmer’s catch at the end of the first half of the Orange Bowl was, well, perfect in every way.
"I honestly think the "Spread HD" is going to work pretty well, and we’ll be just fine this year". - 8-27-2008
by jesse. on Mar 31, 2009 3:48 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
It may not be the greatest...
…But Bryant Johnson’s circus catch amongst three defenders in the 2002 Iowa game was pretty amazing. I still haven’t gotten over that game.
"Breaststroke, free style," Rubin said of his technique, "Let’s see Phelps do that one."
by ReadingRambler on Mar 31, 2009 4:09 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Time, snow and controversy
The three ingredients that make a football rivalry. It will happen.
by Cairo on Mar 31, 2009 12:37 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Also
More to the point of this post, I don’t ever see PSU/UM becomming an “intense” rivalry. PSU/OSU has a better shot. Aside from those involving ND, I can’t think of many real rivalries that span at least a couple states. And I think that is mainly due to the subway alum population ND has and their general hateability.
You are right that winning will breed some hate, and if teams are highly ranked, I can see individiaul games being a big deal. But, year to year, the thing that sustains rivalries (IMO) is proximity more than anything else. If you work with fans of another school, have some in the family, in-laws, etc, that makes a rivaly personal. I just don’t see enough overlap between UM/PSU to get that going long term.
Like Wisconsin in the 90s. They were successful (2 rose bowls), we wanted to beat them, they hated us, etc. But to compare it to OSU, not even close.
by Wlvrn99 on Mar 31, 2009 12:49 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
agreed
but… the feeling i’ve gotten from my friends at PSU is that you guys get more up for the Michigan game every year than most others. While maybe not reflected properly in the W-L column, the two teams have been EXTREMELY competitive. Add in the ref controversies for both teams (albeit, Michigan’s become forgotten as we ended up winning anyways), and you’ve got a pretty good rivalry building.
I agree its nowhere near OSU level, but probably closer to MSU. MSU has all the angst on one side of the field (them toward Michigan), while PSU/UM has the same angst divided equally.
by formerlyanonymous on Mar 31, 2009 12:59 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Well I think OSU is the clear #1 game
right now, and probably since 2005. This is mostly because it’s been the BT Championship two of the last four years, the same type of situation that in large part led to the OSU-UM rivalry becoming so big.
Before that every game was equally big if for no other reason that each loss in the Dark Years meant giving up a little piece of your soul. My best memory from 2004 (however sad this is) was most definitely Indiana, and that’s kind of the point I was trying to quickly make in the post. I like how each game kind of stands on its own, I’m not against a renewed Pitt game per se, but it’s nice to have each Saturday happening for its own sake.
As for Michigan currently being a ‘big game’, I think most of that stems from (1) the losing streak, and (2) most people feeling totally screwed after 2002 and 2005. Now that the streak is over and Um is rebuilding, it’s probably going to end up being the 3rd to 5th biggest game, bumped down by Iowa but still high because people from PA seem to have long memories when it comes to sports.
Black Shoe Diaries
I BLAME IOWA.
by Kevin HD on Mar 31, 2009 1:46 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Agreed
Curse you Lafayette!!! (first loss)
Curse you Yale!!! (prevented first undefeated season)
Curse you Navy!!! (prevented first perfect season)
Curse you Harvard, Waynesburg, Homestead AC, Toledo, UNC, Steelton YMCA, Columbia, Florida, Yale, Vanderbilt, Oklahoma, Princeton, Duquesne AC, and Clemson (all the teams who have beaten us but who we have never beaten)
by The JuggerNitt on Mar 31, 2009 3:23 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
At least we fixed Buffalo.
Sure it took 107 years, but we had not forgotten our 0-1 record against them!
by Cairo on Mar 31, 2009 4:50 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
people from PA seem to have long memories when it comes to sports.
Ha! you better believe it!
"It was an attrition football game and you know we like that."
by showtime on Mar 31, 2009 9:10 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
OSU "level"
I think these things can evolve over the course of a decade or two, which leads me to (politely) ask, what is the timeframe for the next Michigan victory over OSU? Honestly, I never see Brian address this over at mgoblog. Will The Big Game still be primetime material if the OSU streak stretches to 8 or 10 games? I think rivalries self-reinforce through big upsets and wane some during long streaks by either side (hence UM’s attitude towards PSU); as fun as the game is to watch, we’re pretty far away from the Schembechler/Hayes era of unpredictable results.
by gumbercules on Mar 31, 2009 1:52 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
this is why I hate all of you wolverines
I don’t ever see PSU/UM becomming an "intense" rivalry.
You don’t even see us here, seething, because of the grey and red jokers you look forward to at the end of every season.
That and every one of those 9 straight losses over my entire time as a student and alumni at PSU is why I hate your team and school with a burning passion. I only hope we can pay back a small portion of that embarrassment in the coming years. Even three years of losses in a row would teach you guys a lesson. But I don’t want to get ahead of myself. Who knows if your coach will still be around at the end of this season.
michigan will always be my number 1 PSU rival.
"It was an attrition football game and you know we like that."
by showtime on Mar 31, 2009 9:08 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
The Rivarly(s) Are Between the fans
Pizzo is an idiot. Just take a gander at Terrelle Pryor. His final 3 were Ohio St., Penn St. and Michigan. He picked Ohio St. over Penn State for the same reasons he picked Ohio St. over Michigan; he liked them better.
If it had anything to do with playing/beating Michigan, it wouldn’t have come down to the two schools would it?
Kids don’t grow up dreaming of beating team x or team y anymore, they end up going to the schools that suit them best. The rivaries rarely matter.
Look at Conner and Sean Lee. One went to Pitt, the other to Penn State. Did either’s recruiting have anything to do with the rivalry? I don’t think so.
The rivalries start and end with the fans. Yea, once kids are in the envrionment, and get caught up in it, they probably get up for the rivalry games as much as the fans, but in terms of recruiting, the idea that rivalries have anything to do with where kids go to school is asanine.
God Created the World Out Of Nothing, Paterno Built A National Superpower On Cow Fields...
by fugimaster24 on Mar 31, 2009 2:05 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
48-14 never gets old
Even though I was, like, six years old at the time. That’s Penn State’s ultimate kick in the balls to Pitt — the Panthers were #1, undefeated, at home, and built a 14-0 lead against their hated rival…and then the bottom absolutely fell out.
Try to imagine how utterly demoralizing that had to be for Pitt fans. Then smile.
"Never. We would never shoot nuclear weapons at Decepticons." -- Gen. Jack Jacobs
by Run Up The Score on Mar 31, 2009 2:10 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Nuh Uh
12-0 Thats all that matters! Nevermind the fact Joe is 24-7-1 against Pitt, THEY WON THE LAST ONE BABY!
O…And ELITE EIGHT!!!! ONCE!!!
God Created the World Out Of Nothing, Paterno Built A National Superpower On Cow Fields...
by fugimaster24 on Mar 31, 2009 2:23 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
maimi, bama, nebraska, notre dame
all in one year….and nebraska and notre dame didn’t even suck then.
Black Shoe Diaries
I BLAME IOWA.
by Kevin HD on Mar 31, 2009 2:36 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Wasn't that Gerry Faust Notre Dame?
"I honestly think the "Spread HD" is going to work pretty well, and we’ll be just fine this year". - 8-27-2008
by jesse. on Mar 31, 2009 2:48 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah, so Notre Dame did kinda suck, actually.
And it’s pretty amazing they hired Faust as HC straight out of a high school job.
Black Shoe Diaries
I BLAME IOWA.
by Kevin HD on Mar 31, 2009 3:02 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I know I can't speak for everyone
.. but Iowa is starting to annoy me.
Seriously, someone think of a silly name for the rivalry (The Battle for I-80? The Farmers’ Market Corn Cup?) and I’ll get my hate on every year – even when we don’t play. I promise.
by Aaron PSU on Mar 31, 2009 7:57 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
The "new PSU-Pitt Game"
I mean they do wear the Steelers uni’s
by whiteoutonly on Mar 31, 2009 8:17 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
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