All The Questions You Wanted, All The Answers You Expected
by KevinHD on Apr 15, 2009 10:29 AM EDT
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Quoting liberally from Joe Paterno's teleconference...
Leaders, we got leaders. In one of those gritty, honest and original leadership questions, former Penn State coach Sean Lee and QB incumbent Daryll Clark were name dropped as great kids yada yada, but Joe coaches teams and right now...
We don't really have the "team" concept that hopefully we can get in the next two weeks. We have two weeks to go and have made some progress, although not as much as I would like. I'm concerned a little bit about the leadership, but I think that will develop.
I'm not really sure what that means, although I suspect it might have something to do with so many positions still being wide open.
Chaz is fine. I have no idea where this started, and to be honest I wasn't overly concerned about it anyway, but in case you are the kind of guy or gal who gets worked up over message board rumors about minor spring practice injuries:
[Chaz Powell] will be fine.
Because Bobby and Joe are best friends. Guess who thinks it's a crying shame that 14 wins are being taken away from a coach who considers one of his TA's reading test answers to an entire room full of football players a 'flea'?
I think Bobby's entitled to those 14 wins. I don't think you should start putting asterisks next to guys' names. That doesn't make any sense to me. He's got those 14 wins. He earned them and took what he had.
This is typical and expected but that doesn’t make it right. And honestly, if FSU get through one of the most blatant academic scandals I’ve read about since I started this who addiction with some after the fact record book shenanigans and an almost dismissive reduction in short-term scholarship limits, I would consider them lucky. Lucky and another example of the all bark no bite nature of the NCAA.
So this is kind of like playing Pitt, then. Joe was asked about the non-conference schedule, about how weak it is, but instead of the usual "they're a very good football team" routine, we learned a little bit about grudges:
I know Akron is on the schedule and the reason I know why Akron is there is because they brought Walt Harris in there has been some publicity. Walt having been at Pitt the last time we played Pitt when Walt was there and they beat us.
I like this, let's run with it. Sure, they look like Akron, but really they are the reincarnation of the 2000 Pitt team, tacky-gold helmets and everything. Revenge!
Poor Zips, they thought they were coming over for a quick pay-day and instead have to deal with 19 years of Paterno's pent up anger.
TC Who? We were hearing rumors not long ago that the Penn State AD was trying to pull a quick schedule swap as a last ditch effort to save the 2009 OOC schedule. I guess the banter was in large part true:
We thought Texas Christian was going to come here. They backed out. They decided that wasn't in their best interest. I said, "do you want me to call Gary Patterson?" because I like him and he's a good friend and I thought it would be a good game for us.
So they tried. Not that that means anything, but whatareyougonnado.
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"We hugged as grown men do. It was a great moment. Then, it was business as usual." -- LJ Sr.
by millzners on Apr 15, 2009 1:45 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
IMO, we should never play any teams with a name like "Zips"
Have a "great HD day!" - Jay Paterno
by ReadingRambler on Apr 15, 2009 10:51 AM EDT reply actions
Just doesn’t flow like “Fear the Deer”…
Penn Staters belong at Penn State. The problem with a lot of kids is they just don’t know they are Penn Staters yet.
Noli nothis permittere te terere.
by TheK-GunNeedsReloaded on Apr 15, 2009 12:27 PM EDT up reply actions
so for years now I've wondered
WTF is their maskot? A deer? A kangaroo? A bunny? I don’t get it. It looks like a donkey, but they’re called the zips, so then I’m like, well maybe just a really fast donkey. The last time we played (#14’s first game if I remember) and I think we spent a hour debating what it was.
"We hugged as grown men do. It was a great moment. Then, it was business as usual." -- LJ Sr.
FEAR THE DONK
"We hugged as grown men do. It was a great moment. Then, it was business as usual." -- LJ Sr.
Signs you're immature:
You giggle uncontrollably to yourself when you realize that you could change this picture to “Fear the Poo”
I'm ok with Akron
and Syracuse. It’s Eastern (what state is it again?) and Temple that really have me. Why not Navy, Army, or Air Force and Maryland or UVA. I mean..yikes!
What's your beef with Temple?
They might be our toughest non-conference opponent this year. Akron finished at the bottom of the MAC last year while Temple was somewhere in the middle.
Mike
Black Shoe Diaries
Temple
I’d rather play them than just about any other MAC team. In my dream schedule PSU would usually open the year with Temple.
Kath?
by psuphiman80 on Apr 15, 2009 12:19 PM EDT up reply actions
Me too
Opener against Temple, a national power, an old eastern rival or some other middle-of-the-road team, and then some MAC or C-USA cupcake.
Have a "great HD day!" - Jay Paterno
by ReadingRambler on Apr 15, 2009 12:50 PM EDT up reply actions
Mine dream schedule is just that
a complete dream. I would love for it to be:
Temple
Pitt
National Power
Eastern Rival
Kath?
by psuphiman80 on Apr 15, 2009 12:58 PM EDT up reply actions
Well, Pitt would be the Eastern Rival, period. Which means you’d get Youngstown State or something.
Have a "great HD day!" - Jay Paterno
by ReadingRambler on Apr 15, 2009 1:40 PM EDT up reply actions
I think people would be beyond fine with:
Temple
Eastern Rival
National Team
MAC/D1AA-esque cupcake
Could still get the 7 home games with a shot at 8 every so often. Sigh.
by Tailgate Shogun on Apr 15, 2009 3:23 PM EDT up reply actions
I don't think this would every give you 8
unless you took 6 one year. The BT is always 4, your D1aa is always home but even Temple gets a couple of games at their place…the national team is always going to be 1-1 and I don’t know of any Eastern rival that would give us more than say a 4 and 3, either way it’s going to be given back with the concession to Temple. I mean we did a home and home with ‘Cuse, and if they aren’t giving us an improper fraction we aren’t going to get one from Maryland, WVU, Pitt, or Rutgers.
Don’t get me wrong, I want this as bad as you do, but it can only happen if the AD can figure out how to fund the entire department with an average of 6.9 instead of 7.5.
Black Shoe Diaries
I BLAME IOWA.
Yeah, I suppose.
I was figuring that we could probably strong-arm some eatern team or national mid-level school (see: OrSt ‘08, the proposed TCU game in 09) into a one and done at Beaver Stadium while we’re alternating home & home with a national power.
I’m pretty sure we only play Temple in Philly so that alums in that part of the country can see a de facto home game. The 7 home/2 away arrangement (or whatever it is) we have going now certainly doesn’t give Temple much. Other than cash for their troubles, of course.
by Tailgate Shogun on Apr 15, 2009 6:10 PM EDT up reply actions
The other thing you can't forget:
there are attendance requirements for staying D1a in football. Part of what makes these awful arrangements so nice for the lesser schools, besides the money which is also nice, is that it boosts their average paid attendance.
I remember stories a year or two ago so ago about MAC teams in particular who were at major risk of being put on probation because so few people were showing up for the games.
Black Shoe Diaries
I BLAME IOWA.
Okay, I searched it.
The schools averaging fewer than 15,000 were Bowling Green, Louisiana-Monroe, Ball State, Temple, New Mexico State, San Jose State, Utah State, Akron, Rice, Buffalo, Kent State and Eastern Michigan, which was last nationally at 5,219 a game. Six of the teams are in the Mid-American Conference, three in the Western Athletic Conference.
Black Shoe Diaries
I BLAME IOWA.
Very true.
Even if 55,000 of the 65,000 at the Linc are PSU fans, they all count as a ticket sold for a Temple home game.
by Tailgate Shogun on Apr 15, 2009 8:46 PM EDT up reply actions
Fun Fact
Temple holds the all time record for attendance in a MAC home game. The date was November 7, 2007. The opponent was Penn State.
I was there.
Mike
Black Shoe Diaries
What was the #?
I’m going to guess that this years Toledo-OSU game at Cleveland Browns Stadium (Home game for Toledo) is going to be close to that. I think I read somewhere that the stadium holds something like 66,000 and I know tickets are already hard to come by.
"I'm driven by greatness" - Derrick Williams
Cleveland Browns Stadium
hold 4k more than Lincoln Financial Field. So it’s really just a matter of how bad they lied at the standing room only crowd in 2007 vs how bad they will lie about the standing room only crowd in Cleveland.
Black Shoe Diaries
I BLAME IOWA.
BUT!
It’s cheating for Toledo because it’s not a true home game…hell it’s not within 2 hours of the school.
Black Shoe Diaries
I BLAME IOWA.
No kidding
I think its stupid but logistically it makes sense since the buckeyes will be out in full force. I thought it was really stupid when BG played Wisconsin there. I don’t think it came close to even selling out the lower bowl.
But I will be there for a chance to root on Toledo to take down another B11 team, I’ve seen them take down Michigan and Minnesota (and Pitt during the Fitzgerald year) but this would be the sweetest of them all.
"I'm driven by greatness" - Derrick Williams
Where are all the yellow
seats? I guess they’re counting tix sold rather than gate.
"You are a tenacious little monkey!"
this whole conversation is avoiding something
I feel like the same reason we need that OOC schedule is the same reason we want that OOC schedule: being in the Big Ten sucks for Penn State. We need it b/c of SoS, and we want it b/c most people still remember a time when we had eastern rivals and regional matchups — games that meant something.
We’re constantly chasing our Big East past — trying to schedule regional teams, eastern rivals, teams we used to play every year. Then we have to try to schedule a national power OOC because our conference is garbage.
It’s like we get into this conversation every year without just admitting that after Michigan and Ohio State, the Big Ten offers Penn State nothing in SoS, rivalries, regional teams, or even history. We have more history with Temple or Syracuse then we do with the entire Big Ten combined.
In a perfect world we’d be in some ACC/Big East hibrid conference, where we’d play national powers, regional teams, and old-rivalries all in our own conference. Then the OOC wouldn’t matter as much, it would be the iceing on the cake. In reality what we have to do every year is make the OOC the cake.
"We hugged as grown men do. It was a great moment. Then, it was business as usual." -- LJ Sr.
you really hate the B10
And I personally don’t know what to think of it.
The thing is
Everyone pines for the days when we played all of our eastern rivals. But even back then Penn State was getting killed by the voters over their level of competition. Beating up on Maryland, Rutgers, Syracuse, Pitt, Boston College, and West Virginia wasn’t impressing anyone. This is why Joe Paterno went undefeated in 1968, 69, and 73 and didn’t have a damn thing to show for it. Going back to those days won’t do a thing for us now.
Mike
Black Shoe Diaries
Big Ten
I’d rather be in the Big Ten than in any other conference as currently constructed. I could probably come up with some idealized eastern conference featuring teams from the Big East and ACC that might be better, but since it’s not a real option, who cares?
The Big Ten is the idea fit for PSU, in terms of academics, peer institutions, exposure and the quality of all sports. Right now might be a down time for football in the league; so what? These things ebb and flow.
It's not a down time for the Big Ten either
Penn State joining the confrence has led it to it’s highest point ever. Before Penn State joined the league, the last National Champion the confrence has was Ohio State in 1968 (I think, maybe 1969).
Since Penn State joined, You have Penn State in 1994 (close enough), Michigan, Ohio State, the #1 vs. #2 OSU Michigan game, and Ohio State playing for the NC two years in a row.
Michigan has never played in a National Championship Game. Ever.
The fact that the Big Ten is in the mix at the end of the year for a national title pretty regularly is a new thing. It was generally unheard of in 1993.
"I honestly think the "Spread HD" is going to work pretty well, and we’ll be just fine this year". - 8-27-2008
by jesse. on Apr 15, 2009 4:17 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
True.
Beyond UM & OSU, you have……. Wisconsin? Iowa? MSU?
While all are perfectly fine teams, none are national powers. None of them have the “wow” factor that a Texas Tech or a Georgia bring to their conference.
by Tailgate Shogun on Apr 15, 2009 6:08 PM EDT up reply actions
Tech
has one great year and all of the sudden they’re a national power?
Historically I would put them below A&M in the Big12
by whiteoutonly on Apr 15, 2009 6:39 PM EDT up reply actions
Historically, sure. No question.
Far below Colorado and Nebraska, too. But, they have the “it” factor right now. They were a top 5 team last year, and did manage to eke one out against a pretty good Texas team. They’ll be ranked in the top 15 to start the year, I imagine. Whether they deserve it is another story.
My point was that in the Big12 & SEC there are more than two or three teams in the eye of the national media. Not in the Big Ten, unless it’s someone piling on Michigan for being awful again.
by Tailgate Shogun on Apr 15, 2009 7:38 PM EDT up reply actions
It that the benefit of having
two divisions?
Say the impossible happens and the Big10 adds ND or maybe we poach Missou from the Beg12. Break into two divisions. One division has OSU and UM, the other has PSU and ND/UM. Not having to play the top level teams in the other division regularly certainly makes it look like you have 4-5 tops rather than 1 or 2.
"You are a tenacious little monkey!"
Tech
Loses their QB and their best player in Crabtree, no way they are top 15. I say they lose to Qklahoma, Okla St., Texas and Baylor in the south, with the only toss up being A&M. Also, they were not a top 5 team at the end of the season last year.
by whiteoutonly on Apr 16, 2009 12:23 PM EDT up reply actions
Just a thought
But with the basketball program slowly but surely becoming respectable, I think that we can fund the entire department with 6.9 instead of 7.5
$$$
Can somebody show me SOMETHING, ANYTHING that says that Penn State HAS TO HAVE a 7.5 home game average in order to be able to fund its athletic programs? Otherwise, that number is just a speculative guess, and I think that trying to have that many is more an aspect of greed than anything else. If Penn State felt that it was more important to play the Eastern rivals, Pitt, or some national powers than to get 7 or 8 home games a year, it would be done. Period. It is important to fans like myself to actually have rivalries to root for, but lets face it, PSU football is big business and the bottom line is what matters. If the stars align and they happen to go undefeated and play for the title, so be it, but that is secondary. When they are 12-0 and finish 6th this year, then maybe something will change.
by mundyscorner99 on Apr 15, 2009 4:38 PM EDT up reply actions
If you're asking have any of us seen a detailed line-item budget
for the athletic department, or projected budgets three years into the future, the answer would be a resounding “NO.”
I don’t doubt your point about greed. Maybe they’re like squirrels hoarding food for the winter. Can’t get themselves to push away from the table while there’s still plenty of food to go around.
by Tailgate Shogun on Apr 15, 2009 6:13 PM EDT up reply actions
I can't give you the number
but even in the JoeQuotes from the teleconference linked in the post:
Our problem is we have to play a lot of home games. We get over 100,000 people and we’re committed to eight Big Ten games.
Black Shoe Diaries
I BLAME IOWA.
someone has to pay
for Softball, Field Hockey, Soccer, Track, Fencing, Gymnastics, Women’s (and men’s) basketball, Baseball, Tennis…you get the ponit
PSU Softball
Fencing? Get the point?
omg, stop! Too much! Hey, wasn’t fencing recently prominently featured here on BSD?
Ignore the accolades – just enjoy the games. -bb&w
I don't know where this whole "We need 8 Home games every other year" thing started...
but at least historically, it hasn’t been true.
Since 1980, PSU has played 29 seasons, most of which (21) were 11 game seasons (not including Bowl games). From 1980 to 2000, PSU for the most part played a 6 home / 5 away schedule; three times playing a 7H / 4A, twice playing 6H / 4A / 1N, and once playing 6H / 5A / 1N. Since the change to the 12 game schedule, PSU has played 8 such seasons, but only ONCE (in 2002) have they hosted 8 home games (it will be twice in 2009).
PSU has assumed that extra game as a mandatory home game, but so has every other team. PSU has stayed consistent in traveling for 1 of their 4 OOC games and 2009 will only be the second time (in 9 seasons of 12 games) that PSU has played 8 home games; contrary to the “8 every other” or “7.5 average” MYTH people have created. Yes, PSU’s schedule this year stinks and yes, PSU can do much better. But this much is true, PSU wants/needs 7 home games, and every once in a while they’ll settle for 8.
by Screen Name 20 on Apr 16, 2009 12:05 PM EDT up reply actions
I always thought
that 7 home games was the goal and 8 was gravy. Given the scheduling rumors I think 7 is Curley’s target.
Kath?
by psuphiman80 on Apr 16, 2009 12:12 PM EDT up reply actions
It appears that
7 is mandatory and we’ll take 8 if we can get it. In the years we’ve played 12 games, we’ve only played less than 7 home games once (in 2000, and that’s only b/c we played the kickoff classic against USC in New Jersey).
I don’t think we’ll travel for 2 OOC games in one season, I mean, it hasn’t happened yet and going back the last 30 years we’ve never played 6 road games (in 1996 we played 5 road games and a “neutral” site game against USC in New Jersey).
by Screen Name 20 on Apr 16, 2009 12:27 PM EDT up reply actions
We've scheduled zero OOC away games three times
In 2009 (4 home OOC), 2005 (3 home OOC), and 2002 (4 home OOC). Every other year we’ve traveled once, plus those Kickoff Classic games against USC in the Meadowlands in 1996 and 2000.
It looks like 7 home games, with an 8th every three years or so.
Well 2005 was probably skewed by of Alabama pulling out
We were supposed to have Alabama at home in 2004 and away in 2005. It was cancelled in 2003 and I doubt we could’ve come up with a H and H that quickly, and there was no way were we going to settle for a one and done at somebody else’s place. So we scheduled Central Florida to replace Alabama in 2004.
That’d be my guess on the situation. So, essentially 2002 and 2009 would be the only years we scheduled not to travel.
by Screen Name 20 on Apr 16, 2009 4:12 PM EDT up reply actions
We've been over this a thousand times
A time when we had eastern rivals …. games that meant something - Bullshit. We played little sisters of the poor eight times a year, and occasionally, Alabama.
Big East Past - We have no Big East past. We used to play some teams that are in the Big East.
More history with Temple or Syracuse then we do with the entire Big Ten combined: So what? It’s history of absolute domination.
After Michigan and Ohio State, the Big Ten offers Penn State nothing in SoS: And the Big East offers what?
In a perfect world we’d be in some ACC/Big East. Unfortuantely we do not live in a perfect world. But even if we did, I disagree that this “hybrid” offers anything I am interested in.
"I honestly think the "Spread HD" is going to work pretty well, and we’ll be just fine this year". - 8-27-2008
well let me ask you something
are you from the midwest? maybe being from that region makes playing those teams more interesting.
do you look forward to playing Indiana, Purdue, NW, or Minny? Are those teams you just can’t wait to get out there and play, or are they kind of just a necessary part of our schedule? Are they historically any better than MD, Pitt, Syracuse or WVU?
I know we’ve been over this a thousand times, and I know we’re not going to agree at all. Your points are all valid, but so are mine so I feel pretty good about an ‘agree to disagree’ thing here.
"We hugged as grown men do. It was a great moment. Then, it was business as usual." -- LJ Sr.
Are they historically any better than MD, Pitt, Syracuse or WVU?
from 1993 to 2008:
vs. Indiana: 12-0
vs. Purdue: 10-2
vs. Northwestern: 9-3
vs. Minnesota: 6-4
from 1977 to 1992:
vs. Maryland: 13-1-0
vs. Pittsburgh: 10-1-5
vs. Syracuse: 12-2
vs. West Virginia: 14-2
Have a "great HD day!" - Jay Paterno
by ReadingRambler on Apr 15, 2009 5:24 PM EDT up reply actions
Wow, and those were some of Pitt's glory years!
This brought a smile to my face. Thank you.
by Tailgate Shogun on Apr 15, 2009 6:14 PM EDT up reply actions
Wait - FIVE ties in a 15 year period?
That sounds wrong. Someone less lazy than I am able to get an updated stat?
by Tailgate Shogun on Apr 15, 2009 6:14 PM EDT up reply actions
I got it off of a Wiki article titled “Penn State Nittany Lions football under Joe Paterno (as an independent)”, which cited a PSU website which now gives you a 403 Forbidden. But I’m sure there was something there.
Have a "great HD day!" - Jay Paterno
by ReadingRambler on Apr 15, 2009 6:34 PM EDT up reply actions
No, five losses
I guess I didn’t write the stat right
Have a "great HD day!" - Jay Paterno
by ReadingRambler on Apr 15, 2009 6:35 PM EDT up reply actions
Thanks.
Still, to take 66% of the games against a rival is a good stat, especially considering how good Pitt was in the late 70s & early 80s.
by Tailgate Shogun on Apr 15, 2009 7:39 PM EDT up reply actions
Overall records (% wins)
These are records of Penn State versus various opponents from 1966 to 2008:
Indiana: 12-0 (100% wins)
Temple: 25-0 (100% wins)
Maryland: 24-0-1 (96% wins – 100% not counting ties)
Rutgers: 16-1 (94% wins)
West Virginia: 25-2 (93% wins)
Syracuse: 22-4 (85% wins)
Illinois: 11-2 (85% wins)
Purdue: 10-2 (83% wins)
Boston College: 16-4 (80% wins)
Northwestern: 9-3 (75% wins)
Pitt: 23-7-1 (74% wins – 77% not counting ties)
Michigan State: 12-5 (71% wins)
Minnesota: 6-4 (60% wins)
Notre Dame: 9-6 (60% wins)
Iowa: 11-9 (55% wins)
Miami of Florida: 7-5 (58% wins)
Wisconsin: 6-7 (46% wins)
Ohio State: 8-12 (40% wins)
Alabama: 4-8 (33% wins)
Michigan: 4-10 (28% wins)
(All of these are from the Stassen website here, so you can check it yourself and decide which years to compare.
For example, the Big Ten Era record against Iowa is quite disconcerting.)
by Aaron PSU on Apr 15, 2009 8:16 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
wow, thank you
So ReadingRambler just came through and proved what I believed to be true. Thanks buddy.
"We hugged as grown men do. It was a great moment. Then, it was business as usual." -- LJ Sr.
Sure
Are you from the midwest? No, I was born and raised in State College. I grew up going to games against Maryland, Pitt, Syracuse and West Virginia. They hated us. We thought they were losers. That’s not a rivalry, and it’s not even good natured competition.
Do you look forward to playing Indiana, Purdue, NW, or Minny? No more than I look forward to playing anybody else. But they don’t hate us, and I don’t think they are losers. I don’t need to be hated or to hate to enjoy the game. I do enjoy the good natured competition against schools that are true “rivals” in the nature of the definition of the word; “equal or better competition”.
"I honestly think the "Spread HD" is going to work pretty well, and we’ll be just fine this year". - 8-27-2008
Living in the past
I think a lot of people are too focused on the past when it comes to PSUs “rivals.” Penn State has rivals in the Big Ten beyond Ohio State and Michigan. Iowa, Minnesota and Wisconsin have both dealt crushing defeats to PSU and vice versa since PSU joined the Big Ten and those are the kinds of games that make for real rivals. And both of those teams remain good to this day. Penn State’s former eastern rivals like Syracuse and Maryland both currently suck. The only difference is that Iowa and Wisconsin aren’t in major media markets so their games with PSU don’t get the hype they would like a game with a nationally ranked Orangemen team would.
IMO PSU and its fans just needs to get over the past. Rutgers and Virginia are irrelevant teams in college football. They aren’t bad opponents, but they aren’t going to draw serious national attention and there isn’t enough room on the schedule for that to be Penn State’s marquee game OOC. Outside of one season, Rutgers has been an average team 7-8 win team since the Big East was watered down. Virginia historically has a 5-8 win season. The only thing PSU gains out of playing teams like that is for a bunch of 40-50 year old fans to remember the good ol days while the Lions are up 50 points in the 4th quarter. Then at the end of the season we can all bitch when PSU is left out of the national title picture because of a weak SOS.
PSUs rivals are the teams in the Big 10. The university decided in the 90s to tell their eastern rivals to fuck off the moment they joined the Big 10. Yes, the Big 10 has some shit squads like IU and NW, but PSU has always had some cupcakes on their schedule even back in the 80s when they were winning national titles. Historically Purdue has usually been a good team up until recently. The 1999 game against Minnesota was one of the epic upsets in college football. The games against Iowa in 2002 and last year should be enough to generate enough of a rivalry with the Hawkeyes. Wisconsin broke our head coach’s leg – this doesn’t qualify as a rivalric moment?
I just know personally I don’t care about playing a schedule of teams consisting of Rutgers, Virginia, Maryland, Syracuse, Boston College, Cincinnati, Temple, WVU and Pitt. Well maybe Pitt only because I am from Pittsburgh. And if Joe had his way, this is what his mythical Eastern conference would have looked like because those were the teams we historically scheduled. None of those teams are remotely interesting nationally. Outside of WVU or Pitt I would be fine never playing any of those teams ever again. I would much rather play Michigan, Ohio State, Iowa, Illinois and Wisconsin every year than our traditional former rivals that now all suck.
Get over the past PSU fans.
throw the baby out with the bathwater?
I mean, I understand — we have to look forward and forge new rivalries and new traditions. But you can’t simply throw out the traditions and rivalries of the past either. Those games meant something, they’re part of our “storied tradition”.
Part of the reason the SEC is so popular and idolized is that they’ve all played each other for the better part of the century. New teams have emerged, or recently joined the conference, but those rivalries are as old as football itself, and the schools are in each other’s backyard (pun intended).
So yeah, I agree, I should stop bitching and moaning and get with the program here — but it’s going to take a while before these new ‘rivalries’ mean something. For the record I hate Bret Bielema with all my heart and soul — and Iowa and PSU have developed a great cross-sport rivalry, so… Things are looking up.
"We hugged as grown men do. It was a great moment. Then, it was business as usual." -- LJ Sr.
Pitt, maybe BC are the only historically good teams there.
Temple, Maryland, Rutgers, West Virginia, and Syracuse were never historically good teams. If playing them is part of our historical tradition, so is being underrated because we play those mediocre Eastern schools. Boston College and Pittsburgh are the only other Northeastern schools that were better than much of the Big Ten were and are. (Today West Virginia and Rutgers look better, and Pitt looks a little worse, but we’re talking about tradition and history here.) Besides BC and Pitt, the only opponents outside the Big Ten that we’ve played a dozen times or more in a competitive series are Miami, Alabama and Notre Dame.
Big East History Lesson
Pitt – Jock Sutherland and 1976-1982
Syracuse – Ernie Davis & Jim Brown
B.C. – Exactly one fluke Doug Flutie pass
WVU – Major Harris, Rich Rodriguez
Maryland – Put more quarterbacks in the NFL than you think.
Temple – Bill Cosby played football there. Poorly.
Rutgers – Beat Penn State in 1988.
UConn & USF – I have shoes older than their football progams. Seriously.
Point being that there isn’t enough “tradition” in the Big East to get under the shirt of a Wisconsin co-ed, let alone generate any kind of meaningful games.
"I honestly think the "Spread HD" is going to work pretty well, and we’ll be just fine this year". - 8-27-2008
UConn & USF – I have shoes older than their football progams. Seriously.
Nice.
Black Shoe Diaries
I BLAME IOWA.
Well
Give B.C. some credit. They have been a pain in ND’s ass every now and then.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cHO0J75iUSY
(And, no, I’m not trying to argue with you, and no, I don’t really give a shit about B.C.’s “tradition”. And, yes, I was just looking for an excuse to post that.)
Have a "great HD day!" - Jay Paterno
by ReadingRambler on Apr 16, 2009 12:32 PM EDT up reply actions
I will amend my BC entry as follows
,and a couple of wins over Notre Dame
"I honestly think the "Spread HD" is going to work pretty well, and we’ll be just fine this year". - 8-27-2008
Historical Rivalries?
You can throw out the traditions and rivalries of the past. This happened the moment PSU decided to join the Big Ten and lost its scheduling flexibility. The second that happened, the days of Rutgers, Maryland, BC, WVU and Pitt being our natural games were over.
Does the Big Ten not boast Ohio-State vs. Michigan, which historically has been one of the best rivalries in all of college football? Jesus, there’s a freaking trophy for practically every big ten game. Penn State might not have the history a lot of the other schools in the conference has, but they’ve been playing in the Big Ten for close to 20 years. I got bad news for your former eastern rivalries – they are all dead. Outside of Joe Paterno’s mind no one cares about PSU-Syracuse anymore. If PSU put WVU on the schedule next year, that former rivalry is not going to be rekindled. Even putting Pitt on the schedule wouldn’t have as big of an affect as you might think.
It’s over Johnny. It’s OVER!
Rivalries take time.
As a relatively new PSU’er AND one from the midwest, I have no reason to get excited about playing syracuse, maryland, temple, rutgers of others mentioned before as ‘traditional’ rivalries. Pitt would be nice I guess just to quell 12-0, but other than that, I dont view them as any kind of threat.
Contrast that to nearly annual games with Michigan, Iowa, Minnesota, and annual games with o$u and Mich State. Other than the occasional single year charge from any one of the traditional powers, they’re a pretty middle of the pack bunch. I’m not exactly up on the finest details of the eastern teams, but my perception of them (which is probably close to the national outsiders, but that is really what were worried about anyway) is that they’re on average on par with Iowa, Purdue, Wisconsin and Minnesota.
On top of that there are the games with national powers built in most years with o$u and Michigan (they will be back…probably). This takes the pressure to independently schedule a big game or two every year against a rotating group of other respected programs that we would not see enough of to build any kind of real rivalry with.
In addition, there are memorable games in the recent past with many of the big ten teams. Those are what build rivalries. In particular season altering games, o$u and mich in 05, minny in 99, and o$u and Iowa last year.
Granted not each game every year between any two teams is going to be a classic, it takes some particular circumstances to create those kind of games. It just takes time. Those circumstances do not appear that often.
"Even though it was bouncing, I knew it was so soft that it was just going to stay in," Battle said. "Then I ran around like a lunatic."
Michigan (they will be back…probably).
True. The only question is whether RichRod will be coach when this happens…
Have a "great HD day!" - Jay Paterno
by ReadingRambler on Apr 16, 2009 7:38 PM EDT up reply actions
We already have a Facebook profile that we neglect
"Never. We would never shoot nuclear weapons at Decepticons." -- Gen. Jack Jacobs
by Run Up The Score on Apr 16, 2009 9:58 AM EDT up reply actions
I wonder what Bobby would say...
If the situation was reverse…anyone think he would be as classy as…
I think Bobby’s entitled to those 14 wins. I don’t think you should start putting asterisks next to guys’ names. That doesn’t make any sense to me. He’s got those 14 wins. He earned them and took what he had.
Honestly, I think he'd say the same thing
"I honestly think the "Spread HD" is going to work pretty well, and we’ll be just fine this year". - 8-27-2008
Well yeah...
He’d say the same thing, just in whatever language it is Bobby Bowden speaks.
"I honestly think the "Spread HD" is going to work pretty well, and we’ll be just fine this year". - 8-27-2008
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