Pitt diss
Lehighvalleylive writer discusses why Pitt shouldn't be added back to the schedule.
almost 3 years ago
Screen Name 20
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Some nice stats cited there.
It sounds like Jesse ghostwrote that article.
Hey, this game is fun too and you can make it fun. --j. odrick
But I’m biased towards tailgating, as you may imagine. -ts
Ignore the accolades – just enjoy the games. -bb&w
it would have been funnier if I wrote it.
"I honestly think the "Spread HD" is going to work pretty well, and we’ll be just fine this year". - 8-27-2008
I concur
Have a "great HD day!" - Jay Paterno
by ReadingRambler on May 11, 2009 8:19 PM EDT up reply actions
Great article, read the one comment written in true Pitt fan fashion
"If you let the men in you've got to let the women in. I don't want a bunch of women walking around in my locker room when guys take showers". Joe Paterno
It sounds like it, but then he says....
I’ll grant you Michigan and Ohio State, but all these years later I still don’t give a hoot about Indiana, Minnesota and Northwestern.
That makes it seem like he’s a PSU fan.
by Screen Name 20 on May 11, 2009 4:13 PM EDT up reply actions
Didn't know that PSU played at Pitt that many times
that’s crazy.
Also, found it funny that they’ve only packed Heinz field 4 times in 7 years…don’t feel like looking it up but that’s most likely less than 1 in 10 games.
Fun with stats and trivia
When was the last time Pitt had 10 or more wins in a season?
1981.
Think about that. In 28 years, they’ve had 1 good season. Their bowl record for this time period is 4-9.
In the same time period, we’ve had 11 seasons with 10+ wins, 2 National Championships, 2 undefeated seasons, 3 conference championships, and have gone 15-7 in our bowls. Remember this time period also includes the single worst era PSU has ever had between 2000 and 2004.
Final bit of trivia:
In their last good season, albeit 28 years ago, Pitt was undefeated and ranked #1 and was headed for the National Championship game if they just won their final game at home. I think everyone’s pretty familiar with what happened.
"We hugged as grown men do. It was a great moment. Then, it was business as usual." -- LJ Sr.
48-14 Motherphuquers!
bam!
Hey, this game is fun too and you can make it fun. --j. odrick
But I’m biased towards tailgating, as you may imagine. -ts
Ignore the accolades – just enjoy the games. -bb&w
Kenny Jackson's move at about 4 minutes in the video was sick
Black Shoes.
Basic Blues.
No Name.
All Game.
Footnote to History
Pitt entered the 1982 season ranked number one, and won theor first seven games. They lost at Notre Dame, and at Penn State. THey played SMU in Cotton Bowl, and lost 7-3. SMU was 11-0-1 and tought they should have been National Champs.
"I honestly think the "Spread HD" is going to work pretty well, and we’ll be just fine this year". - 8-27-2008
Payroll can be tough
sounds like SMU was one player away.
Kath?
by psuphiman80 on May 12, 2009 9:29 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Or one good accountant away.
"Never. We would never shoot nuclear weapons at Decepticons." -- Gen. Jack Jacobs
by Run Up The Score on May 14, 2009 11:39 AM EDT up reply actions
Take the arguments in that article with a grain of salt!
1. The statement, PITT can’t sell out Heinz Field is true but has no bearing on the argument. When PITT schedules good teams at Heinz, like Miami, ND, of course WVU, they get good crowds. A PSU game would be a sell out and while there would be a goodly number of PSU fans, don’t get caught up in the fact that it would be PSU fans buying all those usually empty seats. It would not be like playing Temple in Philly. PITT faithful would get the bulk of the Primo seats. Also, PITT could package the PSU Tix with (possibly a mid week extravaganza) one or two less than meaningful games. So, it is a tremendous value to PITT to get the home and home.
2. While it is true that most of the games pre-Paterno were in Pitt Stadium, they did this for several good reasons. Some of those were at Penn State’s request or at least with our blessing. In the early years, Beaver Field (it was near where Smeal College is now) was not very large or convenient. Pitt Stadium was much larger. The game was the final game of the year, many times on Thanksgiving weekend and PSU students were on break. Even if not on break, back then there was only a fraction of the 40,000 students at UP.
3. Fans were not as mobile. It was pretty difficult to get by car to State College prior to the 60’s. Lots of two lane roads over the mountains that were not fun to drive in the winter, after dark. That was pre global warming, so there was always reason to worry about the weather for the drive up to SC in November (I guess it was pretty cold for the MSU game last year if I remember!).
4. The fans were not as rabid in those days. There were “less” “well to do” alums that would make the trip to State College for all the home games. I’m sure they tailgated some in those days but not like we do today.
For the Pennsylvania football fan, we should play PITT (and in B-Ball too). However, as a Lion fan, I don’t really care if we do. Penn State (JoePa was the leader) and PITT shit in their mess kit in the 80’s and didn’t get an Eastern all-sports conference done. All the PITT guys have gone and went elsewhere, so the current admin at PITT holds no grudges. But JoePa still remains and I am not really sure he even remembers. For now, Penn State is in the best place it can be. PITT just doesn’t fit what we want/need in our pre Big 11, OOC.
One Problem
If you can only sell out a 65,000 capacity stadium 4 times in 7 years (actually it’s more like twice in seven years because I’m positive it was all ND fans the other 2) in a rabid football city, then no one cares about you.
PaJoe you have so much going on
in there I don’t know where to start. Here we go:
1.) I don’t care if Al Gore won a Nobel Prize for his B.S. documentary, we are in the trailing end of an ice age and the Earth is naurally warming. Enough of the global warming nonsense. It is cyclical. That aside, I think we can all be responsible citizens and make good choices (or maybe not, that’s why government needs to make up crap like this to scare us into good citizenship).
2.) PSU playing in Pitt Stadium would be good for Pitt becasue it would sell out their stadium which it appears they have a very difficult time doing. And it would require PSU fans to buy a multiple game package. No wonder the stadium is empty – all the tickets are in the hands of visiting fans who can’t find buyers among the fair weather Pitt “faithful” and they have no interest in attending the games themselves. At the very least, visiting fans should be able to buy a ticket for the single game without the hostage situation.
3.) If we’re talking about stadium size, a soldout game at Beaver Stadium would put and extra 35,000 – 40,000 behinds in the seats. If it is a money issue, figure out what Pitt would make if the game were in Pittsburgh and make some revenue adjustments to share more of the gate.
4.) Because Pitt fans are not as dedicated to their team, we should play at their hme stadium, because they can barely support the team at home, let alone on the road? God forbid travel 2 hours away.
All that said, this is a revenue issue. Once that is figured out, there shouldn’t be any problem getting the games scheduled.
One man doing the work of 100's for the good of 1000's
1] Yeah…global warming…no comment
2] Pitt is under no obligation to make life easier on Penn State fans. They figure by packaging the tickets, they dissuade Penn State fans from buying the tickets. It’s actually relatively common in all sports and on all levels. You should hear the Steelers fans bitch about other teams doing this to them.
3] We’re not cutting Pitt any breaks on the gate. They get what they get.
4] Pitt would have no trouble at all selling out their allotment at Beaver Stadium. They sell out their Notre Dame allotment every year, they actually sold out their Navy allotment last year.
What the game needs is a neutal site, two in State College, two @ Pitt, one neutral. I have on several occasions suggested that they treat one game in three in Pittsburgh as a “neutral site” game, but the Pitt folks always shout it down.
"I honestly think the "Spread HD" is going to work pretty well, and we’ll be just fine this year". - 8-27-2008
I find it amusing
that you suggest we play @ Pitt as a “neutral” site, and I think it is a joke, not because it would be like a home game for Pitt, but that it would still probably be overwhelmingly PSU faithful.
by The JuggerNitt on May 12, 2009 12:14 PM EDT up reply actions
Seriously
We could play Temple at Heinz Field and sell it out. The “neutral” part would be for one game we’d get to sell half of the tickets through the Nittany Lion club as opposed to 10%. I’d suggest that we get to wear blue too, but if that hurt their pride too much I could be convinced to let it slide.
"I honestly think the "Spread HD" is going to work pretty well, and we’ll be just fine this year". - 8-27-2008
Jesse - #2 & 3 were
concessions for getting a deal completed to start this thing back up.
Pitt fans by their attendance tells me that they don’t think too much of their Big East bretheran.
Why do the Pitt folks shoot down a Pittsburgh neutral site game? Especially if it is a 2-2-1 deal. That makes no sense to me what-so-evah. I could see them guffawing at a Beaver Stadium game being neurtal even though their take would be 50% higher than a Heinz neutral game.
One man doing the work of 100's for the good of 1000's
Reply
I think you bring up some good points, but you are missing the big picture…
The fact is that Pitt gets more out of the series at this point in time than PSU would. You describe why — it’s a guarenteed sellout, they can bundle the tix with other games to sell more tickets overall, it helps sell season ticket packages, it gets them a national TV game, it gives them a chance to take on (and even potentially defeat) the “big dog” in the state which helps their prestige. Pitt gets a lot.
PSU gets… much less. We’d get a sellout against any BCS conference opponent. We’d get national TV against any BCS opponent. Pitt does nothing for PSU than any old run of the mill BCS team would do. That’s not an indictment against Pitt, it’s simply the truth. Short of playing a powerhouse team like USC or Florida, PSU isn’t going to get any particular benefit from Pitt versus Boston College versus Oregon St versus UNC versus whomever — still a sellout, still a network TV broadcast, still the same amount of “hype” by tWWL.
So, the point is that you are absolutely correct: once upon a time, before the 60’s, PSU had good reason for playing extra games at Pittsburgh. It made sense — for both teams. That’s the key point here — the history in this series has suggested that when something was beneficial for both teams, there was no problem with an unbalanced series. Once upon a time, PSU accepted that and acted accordingly.
Now, the tables are turned — Pitt gets far more from playing the series than PSU. So, the only sensible thing — based on a tradition established over many years in the series — PSU would need to get something “extra” out of the series to make it worthwhile. And that thing is clear — PSU should be getting extra home games in any long term deal — either a 2-1 or 3-2 split. That way, Pitt gets their benefits — home games that sellout, motivate season ticket sales, and can be coupled with other games to sell more tix; national TV time; the opportunity to prove themselves against the premier team in the state and claim that crown. PSU gets something as well — extra home games, providing additional revenues and the ability to be more flexible with scheduling to maintain 7+ home games. Both sides win. See the key there? Much like PSU playing in Pittsburgh all those years ago, this is a win-win for both sides.
The premise that is “insulting” to Pitt for PSU to demand extra home games is stupid once anyone spends 10 seconds looking at the history of the series. The series has never been about “fairness” — it’s been about the team in the better situation dictating the terms. Turnabout is fair play.
Here, I just saw this article
It’s about the University of Cincinnati. Toward the bottom they basicly address the fact that they have to deal with Ohio State. Their solution is that they don’t. They assume that Ohio State is going to get the kids want, and they simply have to hold serve against everybody else. It works for them, they won their league last year, and they have become steadily more competitive.
If the article was about Pitt, two seconds into it they would be complaining about not being able to play Penn State. But think about how ridiculous Bryan Kelly would sound if he started whining that Ohio State would not agree to play Cincinnati, home and home, forever.
Other than a tradition that got cancelled almost 20 years ago, the Penn State/Pitt dynamic is the same Ohio State and Cincinnati. Pitt should not get anything from PSU that OSU would not give to Cincinnati.
"I honestly think the "Spread HD" is going to work pretty well, and we’ll be just fine this year". - 8-27-2008
What a perfect comparison…I agree completely…Pitt still hangs on to their “Dan Marino” years and they convince themselves they are just as relevant as any big time program. But it is beginning to waver… My Pitt Alum friend stated this year and I quote “I must admit, watching Penn State and their following this year, finally convinced me that we are a basketball school”
and I'd wager $
that Penn State sent more people to the NIT final 4 and championship game than Pitt did to their Final 4 and championship game….oh wait, I meant their Elite 8 game.
by The JuggerNitt on May 12, 2009 3:43 PM EDT up reply actions
Well sure
but only because we had more tickets available to us and the University basically made the trip available to the students at cost.
"I honestly think the "Spread HD" is going to work pretty well, and we’ll be just fine this year". - 8-27-2008
Choices...
If Basketball is important to Pitt or any school for that matter, that school can choose or not choose to do something similar.
I was impressed that PSU (the administration) backed the team the way they did.
One man doing the work of 100's for the good of 1000's
Not really
If you only 3,000 tickets to sell that is all you can sell. There were no tickets available from Pitt for the basketball tournament. They were gone to their heavy hitter alumni in minutes.
Penn State’s access to tickets at MSG was virtually unlimited. They they laid out to support the team was awesome in ever sense, but a virtually free trip to New York City damn near sells itself.
"I honestly think the "Spread HD" is going to work pretty well, and we’ll be just fine this year". - 8-27-2008
Was every game Pitt played
in the NCAA tourney a sellout? If not, the tickets were available and bus fulls of Pitt students could have been there snapping them up.
As far as NYC goes, how much walking around time was given to those going to the NIT final games? Did they bus up in the morning, take a nice cruise around the Statue of Liberty, lunch at the Carnegie Deli, maybe a stroll around central park and a quick stop in Times Square. If there wasn’t time for all that, maybe just dinner at the Union Square Cafe before game. Let alone clubbing afterward.
I don’t think NYC had much to do with the 36 buses.
One man doing the work of 100's for the good of 1000's
I'm not sure...
But most every NCAA tournament game is a sell out, even if there seem to be a lot of empty seats, because all of the tickets are packaged. What I do know is 1 each school gets a very limited number of seats to sell to an NCAA tournament game, and 2 there is no possible way that there was anywhere near 36 bus loads of empty seats in the arena in Dayton. So the comparison is flawed.
I’m not trying to discount what Penn State did for the NIT, it was very cool, looked awsome, and really helped sell the basketball pogram. But rest assured, if Penn State makes the NCAA tournament next year you won’t see anywhere near the turnout of Penn State fans. There won’t be enough seats, and what seats there are will go to donors.
I suspect there was virtually no interest in NIT tickets at MSG from season ticket holders other than students.
"I honestly think the "Spread HD" is going to work pretty well, and we’ll be just fine this year". - 8-27-2008
More interesting Trivia
We gave Pitt coach Paul Hacket a nice warm send-off in 1992, thumping Pitt 57-13 before he was fired and an interim coach took over for the last game against Hawaii. Hacket never beat Penn State. The following year we joined the B10.
"We hugged as grown men do. It was a great moment. Then, it was business as usual." -- LJ Sr.
before 12-0
we won seven or eight in a row. They don’t care. 12-0 forever. Whatever.
"I honestly think the "Spread HD" is going to work pretty well, and we’ll be just fine this year". - 8-27-2008
tell them the same thing I tell Iowa fans: the hallmark of a mediocre program is clinging to moral victories instead of records and championships.
"We hugged as grown men do. It was a great moment. Then, it was business as usual." -- LJ Sr.
I went to Penn State
I don’t argue with Pitt fans. In my kinder moments I try to explain things to them, but usually I just feel bad for them.
"I honestly think the "Spread HD" is going to work pretty well, and we’ll be just fine this year". - 8-27-2008
LOL!
This totally cracks me up. There’s nothing more demeaning than a good and proper Condescension.
‘In my kinder moments’….that’s rich.
Hey, this game is fun too and you can make it fun. --j. odrick
But I’m biased towards tailgating, as you may imagine. -ts
Ignore the accolades – just enjoy the games. -bb&w
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