Messin' With Sanderson
by KevinHD on Mar 8, 2010 9:10 AM EST
in Wrestling
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PrintIowa's Coach Tom Brands and Sanderson get into it after some confusion (or is it "confusion"?) over a whistle. Action is around 7:40.
HVHN has your story:
Wade clearly was wrong in the takedown attempt but, in his defense, there didn’t seem to be any reason for the ref to blow his whistle. Erekson could see the ref wave his hands and relaxed but Wade had his back to him and couldn’t see it. Given all the whistles blowing on all the mats it’s hard to blame Wade. The ref’s responsible for making sure that both wrestlers know what’s going on.
Penn State finished 5th at the Big Ten meet, Cyler Sanderson won the league's 157 championship.
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Reason for the whistle
The reason for the whistle was that Erekson’s headgear was off. So once there is a break in action the ref has to stop the match so he can put it back on.
Wade should have stopped maybe he didn’t hear the whistle I don’t know. Honestly Brands should have been thrown out, running on the mat should result in an ejection.
But what’s really important here is that in his interview with Jeff Byers after the tournament Cael said Brands coming after him would be a like a bug fighting a windshield.
It was on the radio broadcast
So no but I’m working on trying to find a clip of it or the complete quote to use in my write up for the tournament. I’ll let you know what I find.
I liked it personally because some should have reigned the Brands brothers in years ago. But I’m a little surprised Cael normally wouldn’t say something like that. I have a feeling the hatred from the Iowa St days is gonna carry over to Penn State.
after watching the video I have to agree with Cael on that one
"We hugged as grown men do. It was a great moment. Then, it was business as usual." -- LJ Sr.
wrestling tournaments
Are chaotic, it’s like having 3 football games all being played on the same huge field. Imagine a guy catching a pass and getting pushed out of bounds and ending up in the field of play of another live football game. Stuff like this happens all the time.
"We hugged as grown men do. It was a great moment. Then, it was business as usual." -- LJ Sr.
Brands = (expletive)
As a wrestler, Brands wasn’t just physical — he tried to injure his opponents every match — specifically, continued to drive holds after potentially-dangerous whistles, until the ref physically intervened.
Put another way: Terry and Tom Brands were the Hanson Brothers (from Slap Shot) of college wrestling.
So why would he be any different now?
Can’t wait to see him whine about the Altons being too aggressive.
Regardless of your feelings towards Brands
Can you really blame him for reacting when Wade dove at Erekson’s knee? Iowa has been without Erekson for 3/4 of the season due to injury. To see someone dive at his knee two weeks before NCAAs is sure to draw a reaction from any coach. The ref wasn’t clear enough about the stop in action, and that’s the issue here.
Had Erekson dove at Wade’s knee instead, the wrestling world would be up in arms about the unruly Iowa wrestlers and how Brands needs to get control of this team. Instead, wrestling fans are insulting Brands for attempting to protect his wrestler, and making excuses for Wade.
by The Mexican't on Mar 8, 2010 2:17 PM EST up reply actions
You guys know more about wrestling than I do, but in any other sport I watch, the coach getting that close to the action during anything except an actual fight seems inappropriate to me. The “protect his player” thing doesn’t really fly IMO because it’s pretty clear the PSU wrestler realized what he did wrong right after the initial dive. He can throw a fit on the ‘sideline,’ that’s fine, but as the HC he’s got to avoid jumping up and down in a tantrum, in the middle of a mat, in the middle of a match.
That being said, it looks like this thing hits a nerve because of a particular coach’s reputation, and if that’s bigger than this small event feel free to ignore all of the above.
I know about your diabolical plan.
Oh, I agree completely that Brands should not have been on the mat.
He can make his case from his corner, or, at most, from the front of the scorer’s table. He definitely did not need to be anywhere near the center of the mat.
Brands is clearly passionate, and sometimes to a fault. However, the problem with Brands’ action isn’t the “whining,” it’s his failure to remain composed enough to make his opinion heard from outside the mat. My issue was more with bveo’s remark that Brands whines too much, when any coach would have lost his mind in that situation.
by The Mexican't on Mar 8, 2010 2:51 PM EST up reply actions
I have to disagree
I can really blame him, I’m sure he was upset, but I think gauging from the video it was an honest mistake by Wade who probably didn’t hear the whistle. There’s no excuse for that type of reaction. No one should be running out on the mat like that and then screaming at Wade and Sanderson was completely out of line, especially Wade.
I’m so sick of everyone excusing this type of behavior as being passionate. There’s being passionate and then there is being an -sshat. Actions like that are completely classless. It bothers me because Iowa in the position they’ve been in for the past few years are basically the public image of wrestling. I find highly disturbing people would think that the way the Iowa coaching staff acts is typical of wrestling and wrestling coaches. There are rules everyone should be forced to follow them.
Truthfully had Erekson done the same thing as you said, I would have thought nothing of it much like I thought nothing of it when Wade did. Watching the video the first time I was surprised that’s what set Brands because you see this happen in matches all the time. Especially at tournaments when there are multiple mats and multiple whistles along with tons of people screaming. I do agree the ref is mostly to blame here, why he was standing so far from the wrestlers is beyond me but Big Ten wrestling refs are terrible.
To be clear
I’m not solely calling out the Iowa coaches here. They happen to be the topic of discussion here and I think they are some of the most extreme. But there are plenty of other coaches who are all over the mat way too much.
And I do appreciate the Brands passion for their sport and team. I used to get very upset with the old Penn State coaching staff. Most of the match they were just on the benching sitting there hardly showing any emotion at all. It was really nice when Mark Perry came in and started getting some fire on the sideline.
Had Brands been ejected, I would not have complained.
His running out on the mat is similar to a coach charging a referee in a basketball game, or a manager in baseball, and it does warrant ejection.
Maybe the passion idea won’t fly, but I don’t believe it’s whining, either.
by The Mexican't on Mar 8, 2010 2:59 PM EST up reply actions
Yea agree
I wouldn’t label it whining either.
Let me try again ...
Sorry, I wrote that hurriedly and not clearly …
The only 2 people I blame are the refs. Erekson lost his headgear at least 10 sec before Wade’s escape. That’s plenty of time to anticipate blowing the whistle and getting between the wrestlers.
I do appreciate Brands’ passion, if not always his methods. And I’m not accusing Brands of whining in this instance. In other instances, perhaps. But not here. I certainly relish his future whining about the Altons. (We can all agree to that, right?)
Defending his players is the coach’s job — Brands is right to react, yell at the refs, and accuse them of not protecting Erekson. Jumping onto the mat as if he were shot out of a cannon isn’t. Neither is getting in Sanderson’s face unless (1) Wade were clearly dirty, (2) Sanderson has a reputation for dirty wrestling, (3) Brands was trying to fire up Erekson or the crowd, or (4) Brands was trying to get inside Wade’s head.
If Brands seriously believes (1) or (2), then one might accuse him of projecting. (I’m not accusing Brands of being a dirty coach, despite Metcalf’s actions in last year’s title loss to Caldwell.)
(3) and (4) might be called a “Gable.”
I think Sanderson and Brands might have an honest dislike for each other.
It seems to me that they may end up bumping chests a few times over the next few years.
by The Mexican't on Mar 8, 2010 6:22 PM EST up reply actions
Why?
I don’t care about wrestling.
"It’s just that, reading through this thread, it appears you’re getting your ass kicked." -jtothep
by ReadingRambler on Mar 8, 2010 4:03 PM EST up reply actions
Cael is just jealous because he's forever attached to PSU and Iowa State.
Two schools bonded by their owners in da IC…
"It’s just that, reading through this thread, it appears you’re getting your ass kicked." -jtothep
by ReadingRambler on Mar 8, 2010 4:04 PM EST up reply actions
Just by looking at the 2 standing next to each other
It’s hard to imagne Brands would stand much of a chance. Sanderson’s got 50+ pounds on Brands. Plus, as Iowa State fans are quick to point out, no one’s ever beaten the man. He’s untouchable, yadda yadda yadda.
by The Mexican't on Mar 8, 2010 3:53 PM EST up reply actions
But Brands is such a dirty wrestler!
Clearly, he’d just try to injure St. Cael, not take him on in any sort of fair fight or anything.
Come on, get your stereotypes in line, man!
"I want to be a cowboy. I don't want to be a panda. Pandas are boring, stupid and boring. Bad panda!"
How defensive of you, Ross.
"It’s just that, reading through this thread, it appears you’re getting your ass kicked." -jtothep
by ReadingRambler on Mar 8, 2010 5:38 PM EST up reply actions
Defensive?
Meh. I just think the hyperbole gets out of hand at times.
I really don’t care what you guys say about Brands. The idea that Sanderson is annoying, but whatever.
"I want to be a cowboy. I don't want to be a panda. Pandas are boring, stupid and boring. Bad panda!"
Doesn't this stuff happen in wrestling all the time?
Where were the chairs to bash over each others heads, and how come I didn’t see any ropes for people to jump off of?
by The JuggerNitt on Mar 8, 2010 6:57 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
I just watched again
Being home from work I could watch and listen to the video. I love the guy yelling “Punch him punch him get em Brands”. Classy. Also do you really want Brands going toe to toe with Cael in a fight. I might give him a chance wrestling but come on. It’s also enjoyable when they’re upset that Iowa gets a bench warning from the ref. If you watch again you can see the other Brands go behind the scorer’s table and get into it with Cody Sanderson.
And can someone explain to me why all the Iowa fans call Cael a sellout. I would think their hatred for an instate rival would make them happy he left them high and dry. And it’s convenient how they all forget their coach and half their team including the golden boy Metcalf came from Virginia Tech.
I also enjoy how they comment in the next sequence how they comment Erekson probably couldn’t hear the ref. haha
Blah blah blah.
I love the guy yelling "Punch him punch him get em Brands". Classy.
Yeah, Iowa really has the market cornered on asshole fans. Please.
And can someone explain to me why all the Iowa fans call Cael a sellout.
If you want to be literal about it, he is a sellout. He left his alma mater, the school that had given him a head coaching opportunity at a young age, for a job that he had no ties to whatsoever. He went to PSU for money and resources. That’s certainly understandable, but still a bit dickish, given his strong ties to ISU and the things they’d done for him.
I would think their hatred for an instate rival would make them happy he left them high and dry.
What about disliking Iowa State would preclude Iowa fans from also ripping on Sanderson?
And it’s convenient how they all forget their coach and half their team including the golden boy Metcalf came from Virginia Tech.
Yeah, Brands going back to his alma mater and dream job is exactly the same as Sanderson taking the money and running to PSU. Transfers are what they are; athletes commit to coaches in wrestling as much (or more) as they do in any sport. And I’m not sure which Iowa fans conveniently “forget” that information, or even what it has to do with whatever ill-defined point you’re trying to make.
Also: “half the team”? The only Virginia Tech guys starting on the current team are Metcalf and Borschel. Try again.
"I want to be a cowboy. I don't want to be a panda. Pandas are boring, stupid and boring. Bad panda!"
I don't know the answer to this at all
but I find it curious that you single out “current team”.
What was the percentage of VT players on the team when Brands first became coach?
by The JuggerNitt on Mar 9, 2010 12:00 PM EST up reply actions
There were five kids that came with him.
One never wrestled for Iowa on the varsity team. The other four did. Metcalf and Borschel have been starters for the last two years. Slaton and LeClere have bounced in and out of the lineup.
Slaton, Metcalf, and Borschel contributed a lot of Iowa’s national title two years ago. Aside from Metcalf, no one contributed much to last year’s title. Only Metcalf and Borschel will be contributing to this year’s national title push.
"I want to be a cowboy. I don't want to be a panda. Pandas are boring, stupid and boring. Bad panda!"
What?!
So wait it’s wrong for me to make fun of the jerk in the background of the video. Where did I say he was representative of the entire Iowa fan base? Every team has their own fans who are jerks. I was merely commenting on how ridiculous the guy video tapping this match was. Also I wonder if he was Erekson’s dad and I say that only because who in their right mind would waste video on watching these two wrestle. haha
So wait I just changed jobs a year ago and left the company that gave me my first job. I got slightly more money in the process but that wasn’t my reason for leaving does that make me a sell out too. Cael has said time and time again he likes the resources and the recruiting opportunities at Penn State. It’s also pretty well known that the Iowa St AD is basically a complete moron who can be at worst partially blamed for Cael leaving, since they never had the best relationship.
Yea ok I guess the guess who aren’t in the starting line up don’t count as part of the team. And notice that the two guys you mentioned are the two best wrestlers on the team, well maybe top 3 McDonough is up there too. Still you can’t excuse what Brands did in one breath and then call out Cael in the next. Brands promised Va Tech he was going to build up their program when he went there and he basically ended up crushing it. Notice that the only person to transfer to Penn State was Cyler Cael’s brother. Sure David Taylor came too but he hadn’t signed his letter yet to go to Iowa St. Just because Brands happened to be going back to the school he graduated from doesn’t make the situation any better.
No matter how you feel about the situation coaching is like any other job, people make decisions on what’s best for them. I’m sick of hearing all these people calling Cael a sellout. If you hate him fine, but at least come up with a real reason to bash him.
Whatever.
Also I wonder if he was Erekson’s dad and I say that only because who in their right mind would waste video on watching these two wrestle. haha
God forbid someone should want to tape a match between two top 20 guys and a Big Ten Tournament semifinal that isn’t being televised or streamed. Who would want to watch that?!
Yea ok I guess the guess who aren’t in the starting line up don’t count as part of the team.
Obviously they help guys improve in training. If you want to go that route, the math makes you look even more retarded — 4 guys out of a room of 40?
And notice that the two guys you mentioned are the two best wrestlers on the team, well maybe top 3 McDonough is up there too.
And? Maybe they’ll contribute a lot of points to this year’s national title push, maybe they won’t — Borschel wound up getting upset and doing nothing last year. Guys like Morningstar, Erekson, and Keddy (who were not part of the VT group) contributed a lot of points. Obviously the VT kids are an asset and I don’t think Iowa fans have ever denied that, but they’d still be a solid team without them.
Still you can’t excuse what Brands did in one breath and then call out Cael in the next. Brands promised Va Tech he was going to build up their program when he went there and he basically ended up crushing it. Notice that the only person to transfer to Penn State was Cyler Cael’s brother. Sure David Taylor came too but he hadn’t signed his letter yet to go to Iowa St. Just because Brands happened to be going back to the school he graduated from doesn’t make the situation any better.
If you really can’t see any differences in those situations, this conversation is utterly pointless.
No matter how you feel about the situation coaching is like any other job, people make decisions on what’s best for them. I’m sick of hearing all these people calling Cael a sellout. If you hate him fine, but at least come up with a real reason to bash him.
There certainly are plenty of other reasons to dislike Sanderson. The sellout argument is tiresome and repetitive.
"I want to be a cowboy. I don't want to be a panda. Pandas are boring, stupid and boring. Bad panda!"
I was joking
About the Erekson dad thing, I love wrestling and while these two are ranked in the top 20 although I still fee Wade’s ranking is questionable, I don’t think this would be a match I would be wasting time filming. I mean come on Wade took one shot the entire match and it was after the whistle. But clearly it’s gotten to the point where you’re just gonna attack everything I say so there’s no sense even trying to debate this anymore.
Best of luck to your guys at NCAAs, I hope Morningstar is healed up enough to at least give it a go.
Fair enough.
Good luck to PSU. If you guys could pull some upsets against Okie State, Ohio State, Iowa State, Minnesota, or Cornell guys… well, that would be swell.
"I want to be a cowboy. I don't want to be a panda. Pandas are boring, stupid and boring. Bad panda!"
This explains Brands
Read this Sports Illustrated Story and you’ll learn Tom Brands’ and his twin’s approach to everything. Just goes to show Sanderson will stand up to any one and good for him.
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/events/1996/olympics/storyolympic/olybran.html
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