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Preview: Nebraska At Penn State

STATE COLLEGE, PA - NOVEMBER 10: On College Avenue, a passerby walks by a crying Penn State Nittany Lion window painting, November 10, 2011 in State College, Pennsylvania. Paterno was fired during the Penn State Board of Trustees Press Conference yesterday in the wake of a sexual abuse scandal involving former defensive coordinator Jerry Sandusky. (Photo by Patrick Smith/Getty Images)

 

Nebraska (7-2 Overall, 3-2 Corn Division) at Penn State (8-1 Overall, 5-0 Pig Division)

Kickoff: Noon, Beaver Stadium, University Park, PA
Line: Nebraska favored by three points
TV: ESPN. Dave Pasch (play-by-play), Urban Meyer (analyst), Chris Spielman (analyst), Tom Rinaldi (sad, dramatic piano music)
Weather: Mostly Sunny, 56 degrees, light west wind

And Here We Are.  We're all drained at this point.  There will be a game at Beaver Stadium on Saturday afternoon, despite rumors and attention-seeking wails that it should be cancelled for the good of...well, we never got to that part.  Such calls remain strictly punitive, and as the great American philosopher Ricky Watters once posed, "For Who, For What?"  To punish the players, the fans, Nebraska?  ESPN?  It's in that vein that, by the time you read this, I will be the 938th person to demand you read Paterno biographer Joe Posnanski's latest update from State College.  He says a fourth person will be charged soon, incidentally.

Before wading into the game itself, a few other editorial notes.

First, Give.  Listening and watching the media coverage of the scandal, one constant (though tertiary) question keeps being asked: can anything good come of this?  Well, the Proud To Be A Penn Stater drive is up to $40,000 as of about 9 p.m. Thursday night, and will almost certainly be over $55,000 by the time you read this on Friday.  Proceeds benefit RAINN (The Rape, Abuse & Incest National Network).  It won't change what happened in the past, but it most certainly will help future victims and hopefully prevent future sexual crimes.  Keep giving.  Spread the word on Facebook and TwitterMake something good come of this.

Hire Ben Jones.  Addressed to the people around the country who are only visiting Black Shoe Diaries for updates and reaction on the Sandusky investigation.  Most of the writers have full-time careers, and they have nothing to do with sports.  We're lawyers, bean counters, and engineers, among other things.  However, you know that charming and thoughtful kid you rushed to follow on Twitter this week for timely updates from Happy Valley?  The one who, despite never really having done this sort of thing before, was cool and eloquent on ESPN Radio, SportsCenter, and seemingly every radio show imaginable this week?  Give him a job.  He's earned it.  And not one of those jobs where he's forced to cover junior high field hockey and NAIA Hacky Sack, either.  His email link is at the bottom of the page.  Help a brother out.

For The National Media Still In Town.  Don't give up just because you got Paterno and Spanier's scalp.  Doing so will only prove to the skeptical that you were there to sensationalize, not to investigate.  If there's more work to be done, more victims to be discovered, and more conspiracy to unearth, please do it.  I don't care if that means Penn State will be relegated to the MAC -- no, this one -- it's okay with me.  Might actually bring ticket prices down a few bucks.  And we're totally going to stomp Lebanon Valley College at Homecoming 2013.  Eat it, Dutchmen.

What The Hell?  Fix This, Karma.  I'm sure the only reasons that Tim Curley remains employed and paid by Penn State are liability-based.  What else could it be?  It still looks awful and unfair.

We've Been Through Enough.  Look, I'm struggling to keep the editorializing to a minimum here because you know my stance on any party who knew sexual abuse was happening and didn't do enough to prevent it.  And for the 735th time, we're not talking legal responsibility.  Joe Paterno never taught anybody that the bare minimum was enough.  If you're still arguing that he did his job simply by sending Mike McQueary to Curley and Gary Schultz, you are brainwashed.  All of them had to GTFO immediately.  Their ghastly sins of omission combined with damage to the institution had been too great. 

Argh. Most of the reaction to this entire scandal has actually been quite nuanced and thoughtful, but we all tend to focus on the most extreme.  Extreme gets attention. Thursday afternoon, this email to ESPN's Jemele Hill got my attention.

If you're a student or fan thinking about doing something irrational, racist, or violent: yeah, please don't.  The media will focus on the 1%.  Don't be the 1%.  #OccupySanity.

I Don't Even Remember Football Anymore.  For real.  I want it on my television, preferably on mute, just to associate Penn State with something other than child rape for a few hours.  The magnificent trainwreck of the Illinois game seems like elevendy years ago.  The last time we saw Penn State on a football field, this was the scene:

 

Final Moments: Penn State vs. Illinois (via gopennstatefootball)

Star-divide

We were drunk on luck and a suffocating defense, improbably sitting at 8-1 despite having a punchless offense.  Joe Paterno was celebrated after the game for passing Eddie Robinson.  Nobody knew who Gary Schultz was, and the singular, vital question in everyone's mind was "why the hell were they playing Rob Bolden, anyway?"

Now?  Who the hell knows anymore.  Paterno is gone.  McQueary has officially been shuffled into the dark background.  Sponsors are dropping Penn State.  Hell, sponsors are dropping us.  The football program, long held up as an example of one of the few redeeming things about college athletics, is now beyond toxic.  The game?  Penn State's players will most certainly be carried by raw emotion for the first ten minutes of the game.  How much is that worth?  Can it make up for a week filled with the most unimaginable distractions?  The players have had their lives emptied and scattered about the national landscape.  They're pledging unity.  It's all they have left.

Let's Get Those Nerds! Nebraska learned a very important lesson about Big Ten football last week.  When you're not careful and prepared, Northwestern will torpedo your season at the worst possible juncture. Were they looking ahead to Penn State?  Possibly, and what's their mindset for this week's game?  You have to imagine they're wondering, what the hell are we they walking into? It's okay, Huskers. We don't know, either. It's going to be equal parts funeral and Burning Man.  Doesn't lead itself to reasoned analysis.

Logistics.  Just as important, how does this machine even function from a practical standpoint?  With Mike McQueary kept out of the stadium, who is left to send in personnel groupings, nevermind Joe Paterno's carrier pigeon messages from McKee Street.  Really, who can't see Paterno writing FB DIVE on 100 scraps of paper with a menagerie of pigeons waiting for release).  Serious question, though.  Who is the traffic cop on the sideline?  Bill Kenney?  A graduate assistant?  This is senseless.  I'm wasting my time here.

Tom Bradley. Congratulations?  There will soon be a lot of unemployed people who had nothing to do with Jerry Sandusky's perversions.  At worst, this is a three-game audition for Bradley, a chance to pilot a crippled program through the roughest seas imaginable.  There are absolutely no expectations.  He'll be great, and I hope he's given a serious look for head coaching jobs in the off-season.  The man deserves it.  I hope this scandal doesn't make him radioactive.  Same goes for the other coaches, provided they weren't in on any cover-up.

Prediction In GIF Form?

funny gifs

 

Look, it's going to be weird.  Exciting, mysterious, sad, infuriating -- pretty much everything rolled into one ball of emotion with a giant question mark nail-gunned to it in thirty spots.  Go enjoy a game of football.  Allow it to be cathartic.   It won't be easy, but it also won't be easy waiting nine months for Penn State to take the field in a real game at Beaver Stadium. 

I hope Penn State wins, and had this penciled in as a win since August.  However, I believe PSU's disorganization and lack of focus will be too much to overcome.

Nebraska 20, Penn State 10.

Comment 292 comments  |  1 recs  | 

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at 8:15 this morning.

"I don’t know what he’s done differently, whether he’s eating differently or Sue is making him happier, but he’s definitely a different coach out there" Devon Still

by jman07 on Nov 11, 2011 8:17 AM EST reply actions  

Also

while I agree that Jemele is a hack, yea, don’t do that. That’s bad.

"I don’t know what he’s done differently, whether he’s eating differently or Sue is making him happier, but he’s definitely a different coach out there" Devon Still

by jman07 on Nov 11, 2011 8:22 AM EST up reply actions  

Its terrible

When you stoop to racism, especially on that level, any and all valid points (Jemele is a hack) no longer hold any weight because the conversation is now effectively focused on your idiocy. And it makes all of us look bad.

'Why would she have you meet her in a bar at ten in the morning?'
'I just figured she was a raging alcoholic'

by psuphysicist on Nov 11, 2011 8:37 AM EST up reply actions  

Also reading the comments on her column I’m not sure it’s fair to say this was a penn state person. There were plenty on there bashing penn state and jemele.

by psuwresfan on Nov 11, 2011 8:46 AM EST up reply actions  

Doesn't matter

that’s what it’ll be portrayed as

Formerly known as kmart93
Black Shoe Diaries

by Kyle_Martin on Nov 11, 2011 2:17 PM EST up reply actions  

For the same reason we attack the MSM of only providing one side,

I think Chris is trying to show you what else is out there, the vitriol being spewed by some awful people. Don’t be those people.

by Jeff Junstrom on Nov 11, 2011 8:27 AM EST up reply actions   1 recs

This. We are Penn State. We're hurting. Don't add fuel to the fire.

"I don’t know what he’s done differently, whether he’s eating differently or Sue is making him happier, but he’s definitely a different coach out there" Devon Still

by jman07 on Nov 11, 2011 8:33 AM EST up reply actions  

exactly

we are as responsible as anyone to help repair the image of the university

racially charged emails are not the way to do it

let's go state

by 424E. on Nov 11, 2011 10:38 AM EST up reply actions  

This
It had a single founder and the community grew organically.

I think we haven’t necessarily been fair about everything with Mr. Grovich and that is because we feel ownership of this place. Many of us have been here for a long time. Some of us actually did writing (really bad at times) for the site on front page posts. Because of this we feel like we are more than just “readers” and when we feel disrespected we react with fury. As Mr. Grovich has learned.

When in doubt, punt!
- John Heisman

by carolinaeasy on Nov 11, 2011 12:21 PM EST up reply actions  

Rec.

"We gon' get down. We gon' do the do. I'm going to hit these mother****ers" - Dock Ellis, May 1, 1974.

by OctaShields on Nov 11, 2011 12:31 PM EST up reply actions  

Attention *everyone*.

Kevin and I actually discussed this last night. There’s been a very, very long leash around here for long-time commenters (and new commenters, for that matter) to air their opinions, not only about this scandal, but about the people writing about it. Mostly everyone has been respectful and thoughtful.

Attacking the authors like this, however, isn’t going to be tolerated. If your primary purpose of hanging around here is to whine about how great BSD was before we took over, take it elsewhere, please.

by Chris Grovich on Nov 11, 2011 12:33 PM EST up reply actions  

all I can do is try, my friend...

as I told you, you are in an unenviable position. You are following in BSDMike’s footsteps a’la whoever succeeds JoePa. I haven’t been along for the ride as long as many have but love everyone in here (whether they agree with me, or not! lol)
Let’s get through this… ALL of us… as jtothep said in tweet, UNITY is key. You may not love your family all the time but you damn sure can’t choose them, either.
Not giving up on:
Penn State
JoePa
our amazing kids in Blue and White
everything we stand for
BSD Nation



I refuse to join any club that would have me as a member

by TheMightyErik on Nov 11, 2011 1:09 PM EST up reply actions   1 recs

^this

of all the people in BSD you have to hear him out



I refuse to join any club that would have me as a member

by TheMightyErik on Nov 11, 2011 1:11 PM EST up reply actions  

Put it this way, Rambler called me "Pussy" in a one-word comment

And he was only banned for about 36 hours. Horse N Buggy was banned for about 12 hours after he called me a motherfucker and demanded to be banned.

I’m not exactly an unreasonable person, but I’m not in a particularly gracious or forgiving mood right now.

by Chris Grovich on Nov 11, 2011 1:14 PM EST up reply actions  

understood

I just hope when this settles down a bit…reconciliation happens between parties who mutually want it to happen. that is all

"my dad says Michigan used to be good"

by hbeach08 on Nov 11, 2011 1:15 PM EST up reply actions   2 recs

So if I say what Rambler did

AND what HnB did, while demanding to be banned, does that mean I’m banned for 48 hours?

/not actually asking to be banned

//just trying to be snarky

"I don’t know what he’s done differently, whether he’s eating differently or Sue is making him happier, but he’s definitely a different coach out there" Devon Still

by jman07 on Nov 11, 2011 3:07 PM EST up reply actions  

Lol

You banned rambler, his motherboard probably melted. No offense rambler.

by psu on Nov 11, 2011 3:35 PM EST up reply actions   1 recs

rec'd...b/c...

WE ARE….

let's go state

by 424E. on Nov 11, 2011 1:02 PM EST up reply actions   1 recs

This is complete nonsense. You're *trying* to be a martyr.
You cant go banning everyone that disagrees with you, that would make BSD like North Korea.

Yes, just like North Korea and I am banning everyone that disagrees with me. Get a grip.

Let’s not get all carried away and start (or continue) to ban longtime members and friends of the community who have had more than their share of solid contributions to the site as a whole just because they found your anti-PSU opinions to be offensive and inflammatory in a time when everyone’s emotions are on overdrive.

“Your anti-PSU opinions”? Seriously? I criticize how people at Penn State handle CHILD RAPE, and people who continue to support the people who failed to report CHILD RAPE, therefore I have anti-PSU opinions. Simply astounding.

by Chris Grovich on Nov 11, 2011 3:05 PM EST up reply actions   1 recs

I'm just frustrated that showing loyalty and giving the benefit of the doubt

to someone like Paterno is considered brainwashing. I know pretty much everyone here that is currently defending Paterno will pounce on him if and when it is found that he actually did what some people are speculating, but until that time it is just that: speculation.

by The JuggerNitt on Nov 11, 2011 10:17 PM EST up reply actions   2 recs

What's the matter Chris?

Too many people disagreeing with the narrative that you’ve driven into BSD since the takeover? So now friends of mine like jtothep, Paige, MainLion, Rambler and others are all gone? Why? Because they called you out for being an ass? I’m sooooo glad I quit when I did back in September because this place has really turned into a load of crap thanks to you. I figured I’d stop back one last time, just to point out how shitty you’ve made this place, not that you’d listen anyway, because, what the hell do we know? We’re just lowly commenters on the Grovich Shoe Diaries.

BSD used to feel like family to me. We could joke around with each other. Some arguments and disagreements would always pop up but they were debated like adults, but now as soon as someone bucks the authority, they’re gone. Someone tells me you described the commenters on BSD the other night on Twitter as “98% crazy, and 2% mad”? Is that really how a moderator should act to his readers?

It’s because of people like you that our fanbase is so bipolar: “This team sucks (despite the fact we’re 8-1)”, “Joe should go and is a horrible human being for not acting (despite being lied to that an investigation was taking place).” Blah, blah, blah.

So that’s pretty much it. I just wanted to say congrats to you on whatever it is you’ve done to this place, because it sure as fuck isn BSD.

"Hey Joe, don't worry about the guys we lose. Only make sure the guys you bring in here belong here, and they're coming here for the right reasons." - Rip Engle to Joe Paterno

by dawsonPSU10 on Nov 11, 2011 4:36 PM EST up reply actions   2 recs

rec

I don’t want to see this end

Today is the day I died inside 11/9/11

by letsgopsu on Nov 11, 2011 2:31 PM EST up reply actions  

That fourth person

better be Graham Spanier.

"I don’t know who to believe – A used car salesman or the OSU Chief of Compliance."
-rahpsu92

by leeharvey418 on Nov 11, 2011 8:28 AM EST reply actions   1 recs

Don't kill me

but I don’t think anyone has devil’s advocated on behalf of Dr. Spanier.

What if his involvement was this:

Schultz: Dr. Spanier, I just wanted to inform you that we received allegations of some sort of impropriety involving horsing around betwee former coach Sandusky and a young boy in the locker room that made several people uncomfortable. We investigated it and found nothing actionable, but as a precaution, we’ve decided to inform the Second Mile and revoke Mr. Sandusky’s privileges to bring children from his charity onto campus. Will you sign this.

Spanier: You say you investigated it?

Schultz: Yes, Dr. Spanier.

Spanier: Alright

/signs paper
/signs 200 other papers that day, based on similar reports from administrators

I mean, from the Grand Jury testimony, this story is just as feasible as a wilfull cover-up. I don’t actually believe it, but I don’t believe anything else either.

"We gon' get down. We gon' do the do. I'm going to hit these mother****ers" - Dock Ellis, May 1, 1974.

by OctaShields on Nov 11, 2011 11:31 AM EST up reply actions   1 recs

may be true

he still said nothing throughout this whole ordeal, which made this whole situation worse. He deserved to be fired. Maybe not tried, but fired.

I'm on the Internet cause I'm an Internet thug.
#OccupyESPN

by skarocksoi on Nov 11, 2011 11:36 AM EST up reply actions  

Absolutely correct...

I’ve seen nothing to tell me any potential cover-up (“potential” since cover-up implies intent — something quite far afield from incompetence) reached the “Oval Office.” However, once the news broke, Spanier could not have handled it more poorly had that been his desired outcome.

"The limits of my language mean the limits of my world" -- Ludwig Wittgenstein

by SubLime on Nov 11, 2011 11:42 AM EST up reply actions   2 recs

I agree with that statement 100%

Even if it turns out he is 100% innocent and knew absolutely nothing he still needed fired for the way he handled the crisis.

When in doubt, punt!
- John Heisman

by carolinaeasy on Nov 11, 2011 11:54 AM EST up reply actions   1 recs

that is fair

and no previous actions by the man would encourage me to do otherwise

"my dad says Michigan used to be good"

by hbeach08 on Nov 11, 2011 10:34 PM EST up reply actions  

i honestly think that maybe

just maybe.,…spanier is one of the few people to realize how big this is. a lot of people don’t. we have left OJ in our fucking wake. and some idiots in central PA and elsewhere don’t realize that

"my dad says Michigan used to be good"

by hbeach08 on Nov 11, 2011 10:35 PM EST up reply actions  

she has been excellent

thorough and factual

unlike so much of the rest of the coverage. i wish people would learn from her.

let's go state

by 424E. on Nov 11, 2011 10:39 AM EST up reply actions  

She deserves a Pulitzer for this.

@JPosnanski - I saw a girl crying tonight. When I asked why she said: "Because everybody lost."

#OccupyESPN


Black Shoe Diaries

by Adam Collyer on Nov 11, 2011 11:41 AM EST up reply actions   1 recs

One wins a pulitzer for discovering things that then go to grand juries

Not for following up after one’s already happened. If she discovers new charges or victims, then she might have a chance, but the reporting she’s doing now, while solid, isn’t typically the stuff that one wins a Pulitzer for.

I wouldn't trust old rooster me neither.

by spakajewia on Nov 11, 2011 12:30 PM EST up reply actions  

He might be exaggerating

But I believe she uncovered a sister of a victim who goes to Penn State.

by Mr. Rosewater on Nov 11, 2011 2:18 PM EST up reply actions  

that makes me uncomfortable

privacy and all

Today is the day I died inside 11/9/11

by letsgopsu on Nov 11, 2011 2:36 PM EST up reply actions  

I Read about that victim's sister

What she has been going through is truly awful.

Reputation-Vile Thing! (Othello)

by nits4ever on Nov 11, 2011 10:34 PM EST up reply actions  

Thanks for the link

Great read. Well, you know, the journalism part. The inaction of the adults in this situation is remarkable. I can see how it’s difficult to talk about due to the nature of the situation, but it seems like it was specifically uncomfortbale to the superiors that received the information. Uncomfortable enough to change the story in your head and not do anything about it.

White Horn Gold Pants

by DM_Purp on Nov 11, 2011 9:49 AM EST up reply actions  

Reading the Patriot-News made me realize

how little actual reporting is done these days. The “news”, both on TV, print and online is almost entirely commentary.

by psualum9931 on Nov 11, 2011 2:43 PM EST up reply actions   1 recs

haha It’s not often I laugh about penn state this week but that was a good one.

by psuwresfan on Nov 11, 2011 8:48 AM EST up reply actions  

That's the first one

There have been posts this week that have calmed me down, made me smile, made me shake my head at the irony.

But that’s the first one that actually, literally made me laugh.

Well played, sir.

by tuscaloosalion on Nov 11, 2011 11:30 AM EST up reply actions  

If the former AD is Curley, does that make his replacement Shemp?

I thought that was hilarious, can’t remember who wrote it though.

by psualum9931 on Nov 11, 2011 2:48 PM EST up reply actions  

Here here

I’ve pretty much stopped going to any and all websites this week besides this one, mainly because I knew that I could count on the editors and community at large to avoid the rampant speculation.

I’ve said all along, I want the truth to come out and when/if it does, then I’ll judge. If Joe was king of the castle and led the coverup, I’ll be the first one to burn his name in effigy (only slightly exaggerating). I just want to punch things when people claim the GJ is all the facts. It’s purpose is to prove there is enough evidence to file charges/go to court.

"I don’t know what he’s done differently, whether he’s eating differently or Sue is making him happier, but he’s definitely a different coach out there" Devon Still

by jman07 on Nov 11, 2011 9:07 AM EST up reply actions   2 recs

Me too

And I am boycotting ESPN except to watch college football, but will have the sound off at all times

by UPSUPhilly on Nov 11, 2011 9:11 AM EST up reply actions   1 recs

well put

so much is still unknown

i have stopped visiting other sites…other than twitter for my boy ben jones

let's go state

by 424E. on Nov 11, 2011 10:40 AM EST up reply actions  

We put up 24 on Mich State and 34 on Ohio State.

We have a penchant for beating “States” and a weakness for directional named teams.

Do we go fetal and beg for mercy? Or do we pick up that broken piece of pipe laying on the ground and come up swinging? I choose pipe.
Sober (again) since January 10th, 2011.

by nateforchiefs on Nov 11, 2011 10:18 AM EST up reply actions  

I find it kinda interesting that I've never associated Northwestern with being a directional school.

I mean how can you get more directional than completely being a direction and not even the name of a state in there? But something about “directional” schools just seems lesser to me, and Northwestern is so solid academically that I just never made that connection.

by The JuggerNitt on Nov 11, 2011 10:41 PM EST up reply actions   1 recs

HA!

Jokes on you. Penn State’s BOT decided to change the name to start the new image. WE ARE Central PSU. Beeyatch!!!!

"my dad says Michigan used to be good"

by hbeach08 on Nov 11, 2011 10:51 PM EST up reply actions  

Nebraska's capable of more than they showed against jNW, offensively.

And I’m factoring in a little offensive derpitude in our own end due to the dysfunction on offense. Might get away with it against Illinois, but not Nebraska.

by Chris Grovich on Nov 11, 2011 12:38 PM EST up reply actions  

On the bright side I guess now we get to see if Joe really was the only guy who wanted to play Bolden.

by psuwresfan on Nov 11, 2011 8:49 AM EST reply actions  

I thought

McGloin was Joe’s guy?

'Why would she have you meet her in a bar at ten in the morning?'
'I just figured she was a raging alcoholic'

by psuphysicist on Nov 11, 2011 8:56 AM EST up reply actions  

The world may never know

by psuwresfan on Nov 11, 2011 9:06 AM EST up reply actions  

I never thought of this before

but Chris does bring up a good point, who will be traffic cop? If Mike isn’t on the sidelines, does Jay do it?

Quick, somebody bring in DC17!

"I don’t know what he’s done differently, whether he’s eating differently or Sue is making him happier, but he’s definitely a different coach out there" Devon Still

by jman07 on Nov 11, 2011 8:53 AM EST reply actions  

Supposedly it will be Golden.

by psuwresfan on Nov 11, 2011 9:08 AM EST up reply actions  

Scrap will wear a headset

which should help

Today is the day I died inside 11/9/11

by letsgopsu on Nov 11, 2011 9:24 AM EST up reply actions  

I think he's saying that doing the bare minimum is not adequate.

You’re saying you want to hear JoePa’s side of the story.

So at least you two agree that JoePa did the minimum required. Peace?

by Mr. Rosewater on Nov 11, 2011 9:28 AM EST up reply actions  

I think there's validity to you reserving judgment

But the Trustees could NOT reserve judgment. In the court of public opinion, Penn State University is already guilty of turning a blind eye to sexual abuse. If the Trustees did not take swift action against all associated with the case, unfortunately including Joe Paterno, the public would continue to believe that the University’s leadership cared more for its own people than for the victims.

The Trustees have a grave responsibility to the students, alumnni, taxpayers, etc. For them to continue to reserve judgment on Paterno would have only further crippled the school. Sad as it is, what was best for the University was not best for Joe Paterno.

I wouldn't trust old rooster me neither.

by spakajewia on Nov 11, 2011 9:59 AM EST up reply actions   1 recs

another good statement from the AG's spokesman
“It’s certainly curious and [has] not been explained yet,” he said. “Speaking as a prosecuting agency, we have a cooperating witness who has not been charged, while two individuals accused of committing crimes continue to be affiliated.”

When in doubt, punt!
- John Heisman

by carolinaeasy on Nov 11, 2011 10:22 AM EST up reply actions  

Or if they're protecting the credibility of their witness.

They’re not releasing the head of the AG’s press office just to give off-the-cuff opinions on why PSU is firing people. I’ve been part of creating press releases in these sorts of cases for the state. They’re not doing this to say, “aww, poor JoePa, unfair!”

by Chris Grovich on Nov 11, 2011 11:45 AM EST up reply actions  

i agree with you

I wouldn't trust old rooster me neither.

by spakajewia on Nov 11, 2011 10:23 AM EST up reply actions  

2nd'd

With firmness in the right, as God gives us to see the right
- A.Lincoln

by SarcasmJam on Nov 11, 2011 11:29 AM EST up reply actions  

And to expand on this thought

I have had a little bit of a struggle the past few days with coping with who I am, and who I want to be professionally after this. Many of you work in an office building, or are lawyers, or other great and meaningful professions. But I am a head high school football coach. In my office is a signed painting of Joe. Paterno: By the Book is displayed on my desk like the family bible. I have preached success with honor to my team since I took over. I cited Joe Paterno as who I would like to emulate when I was interviewed for this position. What better person/program could you emulate in this profession?

Now this. I wore a Penn State coaches shirt yesterday, and when people asked about it I said I still believe that Penn State stands for alot of good. I want to believe that.

When in doubt, punt!
- John Heisman

by carolinaeasy on Nov 11, 2011 10:30 AM EST up reply actions  

I don't mean to say I feel different, or that I should feel greater about it than one of you, or to discount your feelings

I just wanted to point out how strong an influence the man has had on me professionally. And why I want to reserve my judgement until I find out the whole story. I am just having a difficult time expressing this all.

When in doubt, punt!
- John Heisman

by carolinaeasy on Nov 11, 2011 10:34 AM EST up reply actions  

I have a very similar take as you

My grandfather was like the JoePa of my town. He was little league baseball. He coached for 43 years all head coach of the same team. He played it by the book. every year, the first practice was not on the field but in clubhouse where he would break out a binder that had to be 200 pages long. In that binder he would talk about what it meant to be on the Reds. He preached that honor and sportsmanship are what matter most. I know he had trouble making kids on his team and he would always try his best to turn them around. I remember the times he sat his best players because they broke the rules. I know many people who say that they played for the Reds and you could tell they were truly proud of that. I just searched his name and found this link to a story by a former player www.knuckleheadhumor.com/2010/03/coach-fellins-rules.html he was my personal JoePa which is why I’m waiting for the facts to come out before rushing to judgement

by mjs2103 on Nov 11, 2011 10:57 AM EST via mobile up reply actions  

Sounds like a great man

That is something to be proud of and use as a model on how to lead your life.

"We gon' get down. We gon' do the do. I'm going to hit these mother****ers" - Dock Ellis, May 1, 1974.

by OctaShields on Nov 11, 2011 12:32 PM EST up reply actions  

seconded

i am a high school baseball coach and throughout all inteviews i have ever done i have always said i would conduct my baseball program like the penn state football program and in the ways of joe paterno….it is hard but i think eventually i will still be able to explain this reasoning to people

by va2pennstate on Nov 11, 2011 12:05 PM EST up reply actions  

I just hate that the BoT thought they HAD to fire JoePa.

Sure things would have dragged out and would have been ugly, but it also could have been the right thing to do. If they at least handled it slightly differently and released a statement to the effect of, “while there is currently no evidence of wrongdoing by Joseph Paterno we realize that there is a massive public magnifying glass on the program and his presence is just serving as a distraction not only to our athletic department, but also to our academic programs. To that effect we are temporarily placing him on administrative leave until more facts are discovered through a complete investigation. We owe it to the victims, to Paterno, and to everyone else involved to handle this investigation as carefully as possible.”

Instead they fired him over a phone call.

by The JuggerNitt on Nov 11, 2011 10:53 PM EST up reply actions   1 recs

If you want to make it that way

Like I said before: Joseph V. Paterno will never coach again. That is fact.

I am more concerned at this point with those in this country who sanctimoniously vilified both Joe, and anyone who supports rationale thought as being “delusional”, “brainwashed”, sympathetic to NAMBLA, or worse a molester themselves.

For over 60 years Joe stood for something better, and I at this point want to see if that is the rest of the story.

When in doubt, punt!
- John Heisman

by carolinaeasy on Nov 11, 2011 10:46 AM EST up reply actions  

Well, that's really the point of view to the two sides of the debate

You say Joe, he says University. I’m not being facetious, that’s literally what the two sides are throwing at each other.

I don’t know what Chris said during the firing-day flame war so I’ll just stay out of that one.

by Mr. Rosewater on Nov 11, 2011 11:05 AM EST up reply actions  

That is exactly the opposite of what the BoT said to do

I don’t know how many times John Surma said to reserve judgment until all facts are known. Talk about hypocritical. They only took swift action against Joe. They took the easiest way out, and then tried to soothe people by convincing them it was the only way. Public opinion should not supersede the actual legal process. I understand a desire to get it under control, but they dropped the ball so bad for the first five days that nothing could really save them in that regard. In fact, I think their decision may have made it worse, but that’s just me.

by ajy127 on Nov 11, 2011 11:59 AM EST up reply actions  

this has been argued ad nauseum

but the bot had to do what was in the best interest of every person who carries the psu name. unfortunately it was reactionary in the face of unending media coverage. but everyone who carries “penn state” on their heart or work badge would be judged as the media continued to drag paterno and penn state through the mud.

it was sad…but as someone on here said, paterno’s last great act was taking the fall for the entire university in this mess

let's go state

by 424E. on Nov 11, 2011 12:08 PM EST up reply actions  

how does completely fire him really do more

than just placing him on leave pending an investigation? If the investigation goes against him, then he was effectively fired from that point on. If the investigation vindicates him, then they have a way to welcome him back "no harm no foul’

by The JuggerNitt on Nov 11, 2011 11:03 PM EST up reply actions  

I've said this several times already

but I’ll say it again: If the world’s standards are what we’re to aspire to, then what Penn State taught me is a lie.

Formerly known as kmart93
Black Shoe Diaries

by Kyle_Martin on Nov 11, 2011 2:41 PM EST up reply actions   2 recs

nice

Bring politics into already heated situation.

by Mark Mandingo on Nov 11, 2011 10:07 AM EST via mobile up reply actions  

this brings back the comparison the duke lax kids

they were crucified publicly, their own university demonstrated against them, they had their season canceled. and then it turned out that the woman who cried rape had done this before and was kind of a crack head.

if you skew that comment as me condoning rape or not believing those kids, please don’t reply.

let's go state

by 424E. on Nov 11, 2011 11:11 AM EST up reply actions  

I do not!

I’m right there with you and fear that it may already be too late for the damage that was done in the rush to judgement to ever fully be repaired.

That the primary focus of this whole debacle has not been on Sandusky, his alleged victims (and yeah, I know at this point it’s overwhelmingly looking like ‘alleged’ is just there to keep from getting sued should he somehow avoid conviction, but innocent until proven guilty applies across the board.) and the HORRIBLE response to all of these allegations by the Universtiy, the BoT and everyone else involved (Yes, even Joe has admitted that in HINDSIGHT, he wishes he had done more, but sadly no one cares to hear the full accounting of facts before issuing their verdict)

It takes courage to stand behind someone you believe in when it’s this bad outside. It takes courage to stand up for a man in peril, even if he stood up for you. - JoePo on JoePa

by nylyst on Nov 11, 2011 11:19 AM EST up reply actions  

innocent until proven guilty

is an integral piece of this country. despite its failures – i believe there is almost no more important right.

let's go state

by 424E. on Nov 11, 2011 1:26 PM EST up reply actions   1 recs

As Ricky Ricardo says

“Splane your comment”?

I used to be indecisive. Now I'm not sure.

by PaJoe on Nov 11, 2011 11:05 AM EST up reply actions  

He, like others

Don’t like when someone brings things like logic and facts to a debate. They like to use emotion and antagonistic responses to force everyone to their worldview.

I’m betting he doesn’t come back to respond to my response.

It takes courage to stand behind someone you believe in when it’s this bad outside. It takes courage to stand up for a man in peril, even if he stood up for you. - JoePo on JoePa

by nylyst on Nov 11, 2011 11:21 AM EST up reply actions  

I simply pointed out

That you were bringing your own can of gas to a burning fire. Yeah I just joined. So what. Its not like I’m calling you an idiot or anything, just pointing out that you’re just going to start trouble if you bring other hotly debated matters to compare with this one. If you don’t get why that may be unwise, lostsa luck to ya.

by Mark Mandingo on Nov 11, 2011 11:39 AM EST via mobile up reply actions  

With that user name,

I hope you are/were a Jayhawk fan.

"The limits of my language mean the limits of my world" -- Ludwig Wittgenstein

by SubLime on Nov 11, 2011 11:44 AM EST up reply actions  

and I'm glad

you have me figured out from 2 short sentences that didn’t refer to anything regarding this case.

by Mark Mandingo on Nov 11, 2011 11:44 AM EST via mobile up reply actions  

Never said I had you figured out

But I don’t think it’s out of line to point out that you joined the blog just as the scandal was kicking in, and in fact your first post was that 2 sentence reply to me.

And that’s exactly the point my original post was trying to make, is that emotions should have nothing to do with meting out justice.

In both examples, people were so angry about everything that had happened, they were willing to compromise their own values for a near term solution that had (and will continue to have) far reaching consequences that have nothing to do with Justice, fairness or doing the right thing.

And just so we’re clear here, I’m not picking on you personally, for all I know you could feel the exact same way I do and just thought my inclusion of a similarly emotionally charged situation was a bad idea.

Unfortunately, you haven’t expressed a viewpoint either way yet, so, like I’m doing for JVP, I’m not going to rush to judgement.

It takes courage to stand behind someone you believe in when it’s this bad outside. It takes courage to stand up for a man in peril, even if he stood up for you. - JoePo on JoePa

by nylyst on Nov 11, 2011 11:52 AM EST up reply actions  

whatever you say

It was my first comment here, but I’m no stranger to other sb nation blogs. One of the golden rules on a lot of other blogs is no politics, and even though I’m sure we agree in the area of torture and its use, about half the US population disagrees with us. In the blogs I frequent, it would get flagged. But I’m just a guest here, if you guys discuss politics a lot on here, then I guess its no big deal.

by Mark Mandingo on Nov 11, 2011 11:59 AM EST via mobile up reply actions  

because Rabble, Rabble, Rabble

people sound just like the characters from south park. www.youtube.com/watchv=9fEjJ4Ecy9Q

by mjs2103 on Nov 11, 2011 10:25 AM EST via mobile up reply actions  

Exactly

When in doubt, punt!
- John Heisman

by carolinaeasy on Nov 11, 2011 10:30 AM EST up reply actions  

yea, maybe i expect it from my friends who arent PSU fans

who, by the way, still think joe should have called the police, which shows just how little of the matter they actually understand.

by swiggy04 on Nov 11, 2011 10:52 AM EST up reply actions  

its not even that

its as if they know, for a fact that if Joe Paterno calls another police department, Jerry Sandusky is arrested within minutes. This despite like 50 variables.

Like for starters, Joe calls police and says he heard this, the police then would go to McQueary, which is what Schultz did. So far the events are the same. The police would then interview mcqueary and investigate. like Schultz did. Where is the difference? Is the difference that this “phantom” police department would file charges?

Interesting thought, but lets not forget that two police investigations outside the one done by the “police Joe should have called” in a matter of 4 years didn’t lead to Sandusky being charged with anything. Why this “other” police department that Joe should have called, who by the by lacks jurisdiction in the matter, is going to be the one to file charges because Joe called them in addition to the campus police I have no idea.

Everyone is speaking in absolutes. Yet there so far are no absolutes out there in which to base these charges.

by swiggy04 on Nov 11, 2011 11:12 AM EST up reply actions   1 recs

rec'd

i was arrested by them once and cited another time

university park is a town, with a zip code, and a police dept that is as powerful as any other town pd in the state

let's go state

by 424E. on Nov 11, 2011 12:10 PM EST up reply actions   1 recs

You're not reading.

“If you’re still arguing that he did his job simply by sending Mike McQueary to Curley and Gary Schultz, you are brainwashed.”

My issue is with the people who end their support of JoePa with this. Oh, well the information got to Curley and Schultz, so that’s that. Clean hands. Maybe you specifically aren’t saying that, but many are.

by Chris Grovich on Nov 11, 2011 11:39 AM EST up reply actions  

I think that this is the first time

you have articulated this nuance in a way such that I noticed.

It makes a difference.

"The limits of my language mean the limits of my world" -- Ludwig Wittgenstein

by SubLime on Nov 11, 2011 11:46 AM EST up reply actions  

One of the problems

Is that those kinds of explanations only come after getting called out.

What’s so hard about doing that up front? Just doesn’t care to?

And, lest anyone try, we’ve pretty much already covered the culpability in a misunderstanding thing, right?

by jtothep on Nov 11, 2011 12:13 PM EST up reply actions  

I had decided

That Jacobi was probably right when he said in their last podcast together that :

I know you guys, clearly, want the best for Penn State and you don’t want bad things to happen to the football program…
I decided then to try to give him the benefit of the doubt. But yeah, that cool kids table has often had me wondering.

And hell, now that things are burned to the ground, we’ll get to see what he wants to do with a totally clean slate.

by jtothep on Nov 11, 2011 12:34 PM EST up reply actions  

I do hope cooler heads prevail

both between those doing the calling out and those in charge of the BANHAMMER. jtot and octa bring a lot of good to the blog (IMHO) and I will miss them. So hopefully we can all get past this horrible week in the coming days and weeks.

I understand both sides, their pissed because they feel like you belittled them and you’re pissed because they are directly calling you out. Everybody needs a time out, maybe some hooch, and a little valium thrown in. Just my $.02.

"I don’t know what he’s done differently, whether he’s eating differently or Sue is making him happier, but he’s definitely a different coach out there" Devon Still

by jman07 on Nov 11, 2011 3:58 PM EST up reply actions  

Asshole!

Striving for Success with Honor

by Frank O'Brien on Nov 13, 2011 9:28 PM EST up reply actions  

To this day I still can't stand Tom Osborne

But if Pelini and Scrap dressed like this for the game, I wouldn’t have a problem with it.

by Peter Gray on Nov 11, 2011 9:17 AM EST reply actions   1 recs

You only wish you could look that good

Do we go fetal and beg for mercy? Or do we pick up that broken piece of pipe laying on the ground and come up swinging? I choose pipe.
Sober (again) since January 10th, 2011.

by nateforchiefs on Nov 11, 2011 10:19 AM EST up reply actions  

that is straight corn pimping

When in doubt, punt!
- John Heisman

by carolinaeasy on Nov 11, 2011 10:23 AM EST up reply actions   1 recs

I would hope Scrap wears blue pants!

I used to be indecisive. Now I'm not sure.

by PaJoe on Nov 11, 2011 11:02 AM EST up reply actions  

EVERYONE

COME SEE HOW GOOD I LOOK!

by Hamulus on Nov 11, 2011 7:05 PM EST up reply actions  

Ribs.

I had ribs for lunch.

"my dad says Michigan used to be good"

by hbeach08 on Nov 11, 2011 8:34 PM EST up reply actions  

Blue Band

There needs to be lots and lots of Blue Band on Saturday. I’m fine with a couple Zombie Nations, and Hey Baby at the end of the 3rd, but that’s about it.

by speedomike on Nov 11, 2011 9:22 AM EST reply actions  

Well said.

All of it. The yelling needs to stop.

It’ll be surreal tomorrow.

by budbudbud on Nov 11, 2011 9:24 AM EST reply actions  

Joe Posnaski

Hit it out of the park.

A lesson about the importance of the authority of the speaker: some dude that’s writing a book and for SI and admits to having read 30+ books and countless articles has credibility that’s hard to argue with.

You guys in your mom’s basement: easier to argue with; but I think Posnaski and Grovich have a lot in common in their viewpoints.

I wouldn't trust old rooster me neither.

by spakajewia on Nov 11, 2011 9:30 AM EST reply actions  

Honest and with integrity

By far the best and most honest article i’ve read to date. Hands down! He sold me a book.

by VinnyV11 on Nov 11, 2011 9:36 AM EST up reply actions  

I don't live in my mother's basement

Can I #OccupyShittyApartmentWithDraftyWindows?

by Peter Gray on Nov 11, 2011 9:49 AM EST up reply actions  

As long as you can pay the rent.

"In the beginning the Universe was created. This has made a lot of people very angry and been widely regarded as a bad move."

#OccupyESPN

by IcersGuy on Nov 11, 2011 10:02 AM EST up reply actions  

Whose basement do you live in?

"The limits of my language mean the limits of my world" -- Ludwig Wittgenstein

by SubLime on Nov 11, 2011 11:34 AM EST up reply actions  

I'm excited for Saturday

I think with this game we can recapture a little sense of community and pride that we’ve lost this week. We have a lot of work to do as a university and the worse is not yet behind us; we need this game to reconnect and remember why we love this university so we can move forward and do some good.

Anyway, the flashlights eat our human power grids, our souls if you will. So i destroyed them, and if a few precious panties were burnt or soiled in the reckoning then so be it

by millzners on Nov 11, 2011 9:35 AM EST reply actions   1 recs

here here

When in doubt, punt!
- John Heisman

by carolinaeasy on Nov 11, 2011 9:39 AM EST up reply actions  

Old gambling adage: Bet on death; bet against distraction

This is unchartered territory, obviously…and frankly this is the biggest distraction anyone can remember in sports. But it’s also almost as if Joe Paterno has died.

I think the defense will kick ass and force turnovers. McGloin will make 3 great plays and 2 awful ones. Silas Redd scores a touchdown. The crowd convinces Urban Meyer to really think about PSU, though he won’t get/take the job in the end anyway.

Good guys: 23, Nebraska 20

I wouldn't trust old rooster me neither.

by spakajewia on Nov 11, 2011 9:44 AM EST reply actions  

What sponsors have dropped BSD?

It’s a shame. BSD has done a great job covering this, from multiple viewpoints. Chris has taken a clear non-homer position, and even though I disagree with some of the nuances, even most of the people who were for retaining Paterno have remained pretty civil. What gives here?

by Dr Screenpass on Nov 11, 2011 9:46 AM EST reply actions  

I want to know this as well.

I’m taking names. I simply have no use for moral spinelessness as a tool to attack moral spinelessness.

"The limits of my language mean the limits of my world" -- Ludwig Wittgenstein

by SubLime on Nov 11, 2011 11:36 AM EST up reply actions  

Liberty Mutual was one.

With firmness in the right, as God gives us to see the right
- A.Lincoln

by SarcasmJam on Nov 11, 2011 11:38 AM EST up reply actions  

Yup

Liberty Mutual is on my list of companies I’ll never deal with now.

Formerly known as kmart93
Black Shoe Diaries

by Kyle_Martin on Nov 11, 2011 2:55 PM EST up reply actions   1 recs

Final score not nearly enough

I said it at the very end of a post yesterday, one of these teams is going to win by 40 tomorrow, I have no idea which one though.

Joe, the reason we shout "WE ARE" and the reason the answer will always be "PENN STATE"

by Rogue Nine on Nov 11, 2011 10:48 AM EST reply actions  

I think it just depends on the start

As Chris mentioned, they probably have enough emotion to carry them through the first 10 minutes. If they can score early and keep the pressure on, I think PSU wins. If Nebraska scores first or has the momentum, then PSU struggles and Nebraska pulls away.

Since this happened, my feeling is that this team will either win the Big10 Championship or they will lose all 3 games. There is no other scenario. What happened is too emotional and unthinkable and I just see them using that emotion to win out, or they are just unfortunately too overwhelmed by it.

by GMac14 on Nov 11, 2011 2:34 PM EST up reply actions  

I've been saying this all along

This either sends the team on a win streak from here until next year, or they lose out. That’s my take. We’ll see I suppose.

"I don’t know what he’s done differently, whether he’s eating differently or Sue is making him happier, but he’s definitely a different coach out there" Devon Still

by jman07 on Nov 11, 2011 5:29 PM EST up reply actions  

I don't necessarily see them losing out

but I can easily see them losing out after their first loss (for the rest of the season, obviously)

by The JuggerNitt on Nov 11, 2011 11:55 PM EST up reply actions  

I think Jay should be on the sidelines

Somebody from offense has to be down there. I also think all the seats at the top of the stadium should have nets under them to help with carrier pidgeon catching.

by psu on Nov 11, 2011 11:05 AM EST reply actions  

your kids, if you feel comfortable, should be a part of that

they are entering at the toughest of times there and they are part of a new generation of nittany lions. a completely post-paterno generation….but that does not lessen the university or what it stands for. joe was a valuable member of the community, but he was not the community.

we are penn state, you are penn state, and hopefully, your children will be penn state.

i was wondering how incoming students would feel, alongside their parents. thanks for posting.

let's go state

by 424E. on Nov 11, 2011 12:14 PM EST up reply actions  

Totally comfortable

 Wow, were u listening when I talked to my oldest boy ? I told him yesterday how he would be part of the incoming group that was going to see a lot of changes. I also told him that Joe was not the University, just one of it’s many faces. I work on Saturdays, so am only able to go to games once in a while when i can get tickets. One of my fondest memories is of a weekend when we all went up to my hunting cabin in Elk county for the weekend. After the truck was unloaded, I told the boys to get back in the truck because we were going to the zoo to see the lions. My boys looked at me like I was nuts. My wife pulled some Penn state shirts out a bag and I showed them the 4 tickets I had got for the Iowa game (back some years when Morrelli was QB). Their faces lit up !

"I wake up in the morning and I piss excellence." El Diablo

by UmustbLion on Nov 11, 2011 12:54 PM EST up reply actions   1 recs

wow, i got goose bumps reading that

too bad morrelli was the QB…haha, joke joke.

thank you for your support of the university as a whole. what a fascinating time to be an incoming frosh. it makes me feel warm inside to hear you are able to provide an experience for your kids that you yourself weren’t able to take advantage of.

and, most importantly, on veterans day…thank you

all the best to you and your family.

let's go state

by 424E. on Nov 11, 2011 12:59 PM EST up reply actions  

Thanks for the thanks

We won that game but he was hideous ! Television couldn’t do justice to how much he could miss a wide open receiver by. I’m not usually a poster here, but i guess the reason I’m rambling and reminiscing is that thinking of the great memories that Penn State has given my family helps me. Seeing good people arguing about who should’ve called who and when is so sad to me. We should be coming together but it seems we are coming apart.

"I wake up in the morning and I piss excellence." El Diablo

by UmustbLion on Nov 11, 2011 1:13 PM EST up reply actions  

it's a slow process

we will come together, it is taking time, but i have faith it will happen.

let's go state

by 424E. on Nov 11, 2011 1:27 PM EST up reply actions  

good article on coming together

http://www.intelligentcollegefootball.com/archives/186/In-The-Darkness-Seeking-The-Light/

the end of this week has seen some of the best written work of this entire fiasco come to light. joepos yesterday, this article, a great sara ganim summary this am, a brilliant edsbs piece from a few minutes ago. i will post links if anyone cares enough…

let's go state

by 424E. on Nov 11, 2011 1:29 PM EST up reply actions  

I can't see Bradley getting the job permanently.

I think he’s too close to Paterno for them to seriously consider it. Assuming they clean house in administration, I think they’ll clean house in the football program as well. Deserved or undeserved.

by BurrowesBldg on Nov 11, 2011 11:22 AM EST reply actions  

I agree

I think the world of Scrap but I’d be surprised if anyone is kept around.

"I wake up in the morning and I piss excellence." El Diablo

by UmustbLion on Nov 11, 2011 11:24 AM EST up reply actions  

thank you

"my dad says Michigan used to be good"

by hbeach08 on Nov 11, 2011 11:41 AM EST up reply actions  

Nice work on the summary Chris (minus the brainwashed comment)

It had to be really hard, but you seemed to capture pretty much everything about what’s going on and what’s going to happen. It made me laugh more than once, and even got me a little dusty when I watched the end of the Illinois game again – knowing my son and I were there to see Joe’s last game and remembering just how awesome we felt walking out of the stadium. It will definitely be wierd going back in tomorrow.

I donated to RAINN right after I read this. I woke up this morning thinking Penn Staters could – maybe even should – end up raising more money for the prevention of child abuse than the world has ever seen and I want to be a part of that.

Restore the Glory.

With firmness in the right, as God gives us to see the right
- A.Lincoln

by SarcasmJam on Nov 11, 2011 11:39 AM EST reply actions  

I'll B watchin

Tusca, I felt the same as you. I have a feeling watchin the plain unies pound Nebraska will be just the therapy i need to start the healing. In my mind i keep telling myself Joe was gonna be gone soon anyway.

"I wake up in the morning and I piss excellence." El Diablo

by UmustbLion on Nov 11, 2011 11:48 AM EST up reply actions  

Devon Still had an 8 inch knife pulled on him in 2008 by Chris Bell

Some redhead assistant and others helped restrain Bell.

I had forgotten this, a bit of a non sequitor, but worth mentioning.

Washingtonian and heartbroken Penn Stater -- My blog features the triumph of hope over experience that is being a DC sports fan (especially the Nats) as well as the Nittany Lions, life in BeltwayLand and other things I find interesting. @doubleuefwhy

by WFY on Nov 11, 2011 5:43 PM EST up reply actions  

Wow

Chris Bell is not a very bright kid. An 8 inch knife cannot pierce the mountain that is Devon Still

Formerly known as kmart93
Black Shoe Diaries

by Kyle_Martin on Nov 11, 2011 6:17 PM EST up reply actions  

Nice article about Scrap on espn.com

Always hoped he’d be Penn States’ head coach at some point. Just not like this.

by MB in MI on Nov 11, 2011 11:55 AM EST reply actions  

I refuse to. I just can't stand ESPN right now

I look forward every week to gameday, even the watered down version on ESPNU that starts an hour earlier, but this week I am not turning it on. I’ll watch the game on mute too

by UPSUPhilly on Nov 11, 2011 12:03 PM EST up reply actions  

I'm just like you

I haven’t turned on ESPN or been to ESPN.com. As far as I’m concerned, I’m done with that network. I’ll watch PSU if they are televised, but that’s it. And probably with the tv on mute.

by GMac14 on Nov 11, 2011 2:36 PM EST up reply actions  

My wife was watching ESPN news last night when I got home

I watched for like five minutes and made her switch the channel. It made me want to kick puppies.

by speedotito on Nov 11, 2011 4:06 PM EST up reply actions   1 recs

I'm never going to espn.com again

Unless on accident.

With firmness in the right, as God gives us to see the right
- A.Lincoln

by SarcasmJam on Nov 11, 2011 12:18 PM EST up reply actions  

ESPN is for fantasy sports

and football on the weekends. I’ll not read another article written by their “journalists”

Formerly known as kmart93
Black Shoe Diaries

by Kyle_Martin on Nov 11, 2011 3:01 PM EST up reply actions   1 recs

this isn't a popular opinion

but it is a valid point. there is an excellent article in men’s health about the psychology of superiors and institutions, esp when it comes to males (http://goo.gl/C2UF6). it is worth a read b/c one of the things that kills me is that everyone knows how they would have acted in this situation but in reality, no one does.

this isn’t a penn state problem…this is a larger issues…there are estimates that as many as 1 in 6 boys and 1 in 4 girls are abused prior to the age of 18 but it isn’t something you hear about a lot b/c it is a very difficult crime to report. people are scared and ashamed and are already brutally scarred.

this is why that #PSUPrideforRAINN campaign is so important….awareness needs to be raised about this issue so that it is brought to light. everyone is concerned about cyber-stalking, which is easily traceable…but this old fashioned kind is much harder to expose and prove. we must channel this into a positive.

let's go state

by 424E. on Nov 11, 2011 12:22 PM EST up reply actions   2 recs

The Milgram experiment has been repeated many times in the years since, as recently as last year, and the results have been remarkably consistent: 60 to 65 percent of teachers obey the white-coated researcher till the bitter end.

I remember watching this in Psychology class. Before showing us the video, the teacher asked us how many would put another person’s life in danger if told to do so by an authority figure. When asked how many of us would protest, we all raised our hands. Unanimously.

He then said “You may think you know how you’d react, but…”

Then he showed us the video. It was haunting. The actor’s desperate shrieks reverberated in my mind for days. The guy administering the shocks could barely talk, because he felt so guilty. But he kept doing it. Apparently, so did 60-65 percent of the people in his situation.

\V/ for Villanova!
\V/ for Victory!

by dees ees en drama on Nov 11, 2011 12:49 PM EST up reply actions  

this is so fucking enlightening

b/c every goddamn person out there thinks they know exactly how they would react. exactly! but in-fact, a minute percentage have been faced with this situation and can speak to it, while the rest have used this week to do endless moral grandstanding about how they would have reacted. like they are fucking jesus christ and 90% of the world outside of penn state is a shining example of moral authority.

it is disgustin the amount of times people have used child molestation as an excuse to puff out their own chest and say look at me, i am a fucking moral golden god, i would have killed sandusky on the spot….or, joe paterno is weak, i would have made sure i brought down sandusky within 48 hours of the first report.

YOU HAVE NO IDEA WHAT YOU WOULD HAVE DONE! STOP USING THIS AS A CHANCE TO MAKE YOURSELF FEEL BETTER ABOUT YOUR OWN MORAL SHORTCOMINGS!

sorry for the yelling, that wasn’t at you

let's go state

by 424E. on Nov 11, 2011 12:53 PM EST up reply actions   2 recs

McQuery is not the first, or last, to walk away

How many people EVERY DAY do you think turn the other way? To sexual abuse, physical violence against children, children who are barely taken care of by parents who take good care of themselves at the expense of the children (have to have their booze and cigs).

If everyone spoke up all the time there would be no problem!

I am not ignoring the fact that what McQ saw was in no way subtle, but I would not want to be inside his head now.

Today is the day I died inside 11/9/11

by letsgopsu on Nov 11, 2011 2:48 PM EST up reply actions  

I don't understand the rage toward McQ

He probably is/was afraid for his safety. The GJ report mentions Sandusky circling in the parking lot for hours, seemingly to threaten the janitors after they saw him. Its likely McQ was threatened too.

by budbudbud on Nov 11, 2011 12:48 PM EST up reply actions  

absolutely

I wonder how many people will be scared into remaining silent over the way McQueary is being treated.

by psualum9931 on Nov 11, 2011 3:19 PM EST up reply actions  

It got a rec from me.

With firmness in the right, as God gives us to see the right
- A.Lincoln

by SarcasmJam on Nov 11, 2011 12:25 PM EST up reply actions  

A lot of people are looking at one side of the equation

Scenario 1: If McQueary went on a rampage and did everything he could do to—tackled McQueary, beat him senseless, called the cops, called the kid’s mom, told Paterno…he’d be a hero.

Scenario 2: If he walked away and pretended he saw nothing, he’d probably convince himself that he really didn’t see what he thought he saw. He wouldn’t be a hero, but he’d still be a guy with a dream job on the Penn State sidelines.

Scenario 3: He fell somewhere in the middle, so he’s a coward and an enabler.

I think a lot of people think they are encouraging scenario 1 by cracking down on McQueary, and hopefully that’s the message people end up with. But people don’t realize that they could just as easily be encouraging Scenario #2—especially since a lot of people have probably been carrying secrets for years now.

Right now, a lot of people only have a choice between doing nothing and not doing enough. What the media should do a better job of is to encourage victims to step forward.

\V/ for Villanova!
\V/ for Victory!

by dees ees en drama on Nov 11, 2011 12:37 PM EST up reply actions   1 recs

McQueary's biggest sin was not *eventually* going to the police.

I’m a bit sympathetic to him in all of this, as well. He saw Sandusky, who was likely a lifelong idol to a guy like McQ who grew up in State College, doing something horrific. There’s a lot of “If I Was There I Wouldda” sentiment that McQueary should gone late-80’s Van Damme and cleared the place out. I’m pretty sure that Sandusky didn’t continue assaulting the kid once McQueary bolted.

So he freaked and called his dad, the most important figure in his life. Then he gathered up his nerve and made the scariest phone call of his life, to the other Penn State God, Joe Paterno. Imagine making that phone call, then going to Joe’s house to describe the incident in graphic detail (and according to someone close to both him and me, that’s exactly what he did).

People keep focusing on the fact that McQueary was 28 at the time. That’s practically irrelevant to me. It was his position in this scenario that kept him from acting more forcefully. He was basically a coaching intern, a graduate assistant. He wanted this to be his career. The guy was put in an awful place. He didn’t do everything he could either, but if anyone in the “never called the cops” group approached the “did the most he could do” threshold in this whole thing, I say it was him.

by Chris Grovich on Nov 11, 2011 12:51 PM EST up reply actions  

I'm pretty much in agreement with you

I’m torn because I’m outraged like everyone else about the whole situation, and I have thought a lot about what Mike did and how I would’ve reacted. I hope that if I was ever placed in a “do the right thing” situation as serious as that, that I would make the right decision, but it’s hard for me to come down hard on him for his initial reaction of leaving the locker room. I do understand that getting the child out of there and/or stopping what was going on would have been the best thing to do. I just can’t imagine even witnessing something like that and how I would react initially. I’m 36 years old and my parents are my best friends and I speak to them almost every day. I would imagine that I would call them, if not initially, very soon after to get their advice in a situation I would have never been in before in my life. I agree with you that if it didn’t occur immediately, calling the police was definitely a necessary part of the process, and that where his fault comes into play in my mind.

by mundyscorner99 on Nov 11, 2011 1:46 PM EST up reply actions  

I don't really understand all of the McQueary hate

I don’t know why I find myself sticking up for him so much. I don’t know him, but I’ve generally heard he is a good guy. I assume he feels awful that he didn’t do more to help the kid at the time, and he probably is scarred for life. However, I do believe that running away from that situation is probably a more common reaction than people want to acknowledge. Not particularly brave, but I wouldn’t call it cowardly either.

I agree his biggest fault, like Paterno’s (from what we know), is not doing more. I’m not even ready to be too hard on him at this point for that, until I hear more.

I guess I’m just still hoping that it will come out that both Paterno and McQueary did follow up, and were told by Curley or Shultz something like “yeah, we talked to Sandusky, the kid and the kid’s mom. The kid says nothing happened and the Mom doesn’t want us to press charges. We think Sandusky is a creep and we aren’t going to let him bring kids around anymore. We told the people at Second Mile of the allegations, so hopefully they’ll follow up as well.” That’s my fantasy, anyway, unlikely as it may be.

by speedotito on Nov 11, 2011 4:18 PM EST up reply actions  

I mentioned this further up (I'm still reading through)

McQueary was one of the assistants who restrained a knife wielding Chris Bell in 2008.

I had forgotten about that incident and thought it was worth bringing up. It did not change anything from 2002 of course.

Washingtonian and heartbroken Penn Stater -- My blog features the triumph of hope over experience that is being a DC sports fan (especially the Nats) as well as the Nittany Lions, life in BeltwayLand and other things I find interesting. @doubleuefwhy

by WFY on Nov 11, 2011 5:47 PM EST up reply actions  

how did he do more than JoePa?

Answer that, and then answer how you sympathize with him, but not JoePa?

by The JuggerNitt on Nov 12, 2011 12:58 AM EST up reply actions  

Besides the RAINN mention

worst game preview ever.

Defense comes out strong. Offense does enough.

17- 10 Penn State.

We are not normal...WE are Legends...We are PENN STATE!

by hawaiipennstatefan on Nov 11, 2011 12:59 PM EST reply actions  

ben jones reports:
From the sounds of it Tom Bradley isn’t holding back in practice.

can you imagine that locker room tomorrow at 11:50? I am pretty sure i could be inspired to make 15 tackles and i am more fit to play 40 sports before football

let's go state

by 424E. on Nov 11, 2011 1:03 PM EST reply actions  

and again from mr. jones...
Tom Bradley will ride on the second bus to the stadium per tradition. Paterno’s seat on the first bus will go unoccupied.

this is why i have faith in scrap

let's go state

by 424E. on Nov 11, 2011 1:04 PM EST up reply actions   2 recs

WOW.

I hope the team leaders came up with that!

However, I hope it doesn’t backfire. The talking heads could spin it to “Penn State just doesn’t get it”! Screw ’em.

I used to be indecisive. Now I'm not sure.

by PaJoe on Nov 11, 2011 1:40 PM EST up reply actions  

I got chills all over reading that

"I don’t know what he’s done differently, whether he’s eating differently or Sue is making him happier, but he’s definitely a different coach out there" Devon Still

by jman07 on Nov 11, 2011 5:40 PM EST up reply actions  

Yeah, it's a very dangerous word to use.

I think the whole discourse on this case may do more harm than good to the issue of reporting child abuse. I have reported it before, to my boss, who directed me to someone who handled investigating charges in our organization. If she failed to do her job (which she didn’t thank God), I could now be publicly ridiculed and marked as an enabler if this person were to go somewhere else at a later time and continue the abuse. I understand we are all angry that “more” wasn’t done, myself included, but it’s a terrible thing to do to witnesses of these crimes or people that report it to their superiors to hang them up by their toes for this. It can’t see what comes out of that productively.

People forget how strong their words can be when they have a louder voice than the rest, and anger speech isn’t going to encourage change.

by mleepsu08 on Nov 11, 2011 2:13 PM EST up reply actions   1 recs

great point

everyone talks about the real victims here but lets not forget that there are other victims of this kind of abuse out there. if we as a society make it harder for people to report their attackers, this will have done no good.

let's go state

by 424E. on Nov 11, 2011 2:15 PM EST up reply actions  

Amen to the rush to judgement part.

This isn’t an indictment of Chris. I haven’t agreed with everything he wrote in the last week, I’ve abstained from attacking him, and have only negatively responded to one thing he wrote in the past week.
But the rush to judgement phenomenon (again, Chris, this is not directed at you) really pisses me off. I cringed when somebody tweeted something this week about Nancy Grace being eliminated from Dancing with the Star this week. My initial reaction was, fuck. She’ll be in State College tomorrow, espousing her ridiculous nonsense.
If the “mainstream” media has bungled this as badly as Penn State has, imagine what happens when the sensationalist swine like Nancy Grace show up.
Full disclosure here, I actually am a journalist. This has been a rough week for me. I am ashamed of my school AND my chosen profession. But again, I’m not a victim here so my trivial troubles are insignificant.
Look, I get it. I know Joe needed to go. I don’t like it. But even if it comes out that Joe actually did more, there’s no way even he could have survived this … this travesty of unspeakable magnitude. But the media’s response this week was pitiful and smacked of shamelessly generating TV ratings and page views (not talking about BSD or Chris here, either). ESPN, Yahoo, hell even CNN have had reporters go so far past the libel line, it’s criminal. And they seemingly get a free pass.
My only criticism of Chris is that “brainwashed” was probably too harsh of a term given the state of everyone’s emotions. It’s unfair, incendiary and there’s no way that comment would not spark some visceral reactions. What’s more is that it’s unnecessary. But that knife cuts both ways. Chris’ comments have been attacked just as vociferously, and at times, just as unfairly.

by joe_knows on Nov 12, 2011 3:25 AM EST up reply actions  

Ben just tweeted that the BOT apparently contacted Mike London at UVA about the head coaching position

before they gave it to Bradley. And he turned them down. I guess I was a little hopeful going into the offseason about Meyer or a successful guy coming here, but if that was their first option??? Yikes…I’ve lost hope that this will go well.

by GMac14 on Nov 11, 2011 2:23 PM EST reply actions  

he's solid

did a great job w/his first full recruiting class and has them at 6-3 this year

if he sticks around, that series coming up in a few years will be a solid one

let's go state

by 424E. on Nov 11, 2011 2:28 PM EST up reply actions  

Unrelated but good to hear

I tweeted Ian (drum major) earlier and Rock and Roll Part II is out.

Today is the day I died inside 11/9/11

by letsgopsu on Nov 11, 2011 2:54 PM EST reply actions  

what is the beef

with rock and roll part II? i’ve always been confused by this, do many people just think it’s an overplayed anthem that has no part w/ psu because it’s not related to the actual university or is there something else i am missing?

i personally get goosebumps when the band starts it and people start humming the notes and how we get the whole stadium together on the three letters we represent…but that may be just me….not accusing anyone or saying they should love it, just interested for the different takes on it as i have seen people voice displeasure with it

by va2pennstate on Nov 11, 2011 3:07 PM EST reply actions  

in addition to being a creep

the creep makes money every time the song is played

Today is the day I died inside 11/9/11

by letsgopsu on Nov 13, 2011 10:43 PM EST up reply actions  

So the infighting at BSD has begun in earnest

I really hope this is the last step this community needs to take before we can move on.

by PSU Mudder on Nov 11, 2011 3:12 PM EST reply actions  

ahh

i did not know that…..now reason to not enjoy one of my favorite psu pump ups….i will replace it by singing the alma mater in my man cave right before kick off rather than the rock and roll……

any word on what it will be replaced with?

by va2pennstate on Nov 11, 2011 3:14 PM EST reply actions  

on another note

don’t let espn get ahold of that info on gary glitter…surely they WOULD turn it into psu playing that song for years to “blatantly show” their support of child abuse or something to that affect….that’s their “journalism”

by va2pennstate on Nov 11, 2011 3:14 PM EST reply actions  

Holy crikey...

That was a lot longer looking than I even expected.

The only reason I didn’t post the link is that I prefer for my SBNation and that other account to not be associated, as one account as more personal information out there than the other.

by Tezcatlipoca on Nov 11, 2011 3:20 PM EST up reply actions  

Thank you for taking the time to post this.

I really appreciate reading your level headed approach. The nature of these crimes has invoked so much anger, rightfully so. But people need to be honest with themselves about the situation certain people were put in. I hope you or I are never in that situation. Or anyone for that matter.

"my dad says Michigan used to be good"

by hbeach08 on Nov 11, 2011 4:06 PM EST up reply actions  

thank you

this was very well stated. my disgust with the way the national media has handled this mirrors your own.

let's go state

by 424E. on Nov 11, 2011 4:06 PM EST up reply actions  

Well written, good sir

While I won’t say I’m an expert in psychology (my Masters in Counseling only gets me so far), I can write a little more about the PTSD portion you mentioned. It was an issue covered in a few of my classes, and I did have to write a group paper on PTSD in children (I had the joy of doing the research on symptoms children experience with PTSD).

PTSD can occur just by witnessing an event – witnessing a death first-hand, for instance. While it may not be a fully diagnosable case of PTSD (which might be more of an indictment of the DSM, but that’s a totally different discussion), there is a serious chance that McQueary experienced some PTSD after just witnessing the act. While many people have discussed how they “would” react when put in a similar situation, few have discussed how they might feel following that experience. I’m sure many people would have to deal with horrific memories/dreams of just seeing that act – one of the signs of PTSD.

More importantly, one of the effects of PTSD is an “amnesia” towards some of the events that occurred or were seen. Because of the emotional impact, the brain tries to forget certain details of the event that occurred, which then makes it even harder to properly put together the full picture again. That’s not to say McQueary did or didn’t really see something, but that he may have experienced this type of amnesia at certain times of the recanting of his story. All speculation, but based on what we know about PTSD, it’s not out of the question.

I have tried to remain quiet during much of what has unfolded over the past week. I have gone through the range of emotions, but I have tried to use these events as an opportunity to understand more about myself, my reactions, others’ and their reactions, and the world around me as a whole. At this point, I think it is important for all of us to start to learn about these situations – what really happens in these child abuse/rape cases, what resources we can use to help these children, and what we can do to keep these things from happening again. As a society, focusing on blame and excuses will only ensure that these horrible acts will continue to occur around the world. Learning, and acting on what we learn, is vital.

"In the beginning the Universe was created. This has made a lot of people very angry and been widely regarded as a bad move."

#OccupyESPN

by IcersGuy on Nov 11, 2011 4:18 PM EST up reply actions  

At this point, I think it is important for all of us to start to learn about these situations – what really happens in these child abuse/rape cases, what resources we can use to help these children, and what we can do to keep these things from happening again.

One of the major things my company does is conduct surveys, such as NCVS, to try and ensure that the information needed about issues is getting out there. It’s a little scratch on the surface, but I’d like to think that it helps policy makers do their jobs better.

Thank you for your more detailed explanation of PTSD as it may pertain to this situation.

by Tezcatlipoca on Nov 11, 2011 4:30 PM EST up reply actions  

Welcome. And thank you.

"I don’t know what he’s done differently, whether he’s eating differently or Sue is making him happier, but he’s definitely a different coach out there" Devon Still

by jman07 on Nov 11, 2011 5:49 PM EST up reply actions  

Spartan here

Just wanted you guys to know I feel for ya’. I have always believed that PSU has the most knowledgable football fans in the Big Ten, and possibly the most passionate. Nobody in the alumini or fan base deserves what some degerates and outright fools associated in and with your proud program have done. It’s gonna take a long while, and the next few years will be extrodinarilly tough. But I have no doubt you will be back. YOU ARE…..PENN STATE.

Now kick the shit outta Nebraska for both of our universities, will ya’?!?

"i think it will be mostly feast the rest of the year,"

by Honeyman on Nov 11, 2011 3:59 PM EST reply actions   2 recs

Thank you

"my dad says Michigan used to be good"

by hbeach08 on Nov 11, 2011 4:05 PM EST up reply actions  

thank you all

not sure if i will be here tomorrow, but i will be watching and cheering my eyes out.

i did want to say thank you to the community here for helping myself get through this last week. this community has been invaluable in helping me cope with this shock to our beliefs.

despite the infighting, name-calling, and random trolls, it has been incredibly helpful to surround myself with penn staters.

thank you all

#fortheglory

let's go state

by 424E. on Nov 11, 2011 4:27 PM EST reply actions  

From a friend, current grad student, via Twitter
A Nebraska fan just bought the bar a round of shots. So classy.

See Nebraska. We’re good people. We’ve been good hosts all season long (many Bama, Iowa, and Purdue fans have attested to that). And we just want to get back to normalcy. Glad to see the Nebraska fans are obliging and helping us recover (with alcohol).

"In the beginning the Universe was created. This has made a lot of people very angry and been widely regarded as a bad move."

#OccupyESPN

by IcersGuy on Nov 11, 2011 5:48 PM EST reply actions   2 recs

Damn Cornhuskers...

Ruining the hatred that I have cultivated for them since 1994 by being really f-ing good people.

by Tezcatlipoca on Nov 11, 2011 6:28 PM EST up reply actions   1 recs

Brainwashing?

Seriously? I would be laughed out of any informed academic discussion were I to start tossing this term around. There has been no support for this concept among sober scholars for 30 years. I might just as well stake out a claim for a Ptolemaic model of the solar system.

RUTS, you’re making a mistake here, one I believe you’ll come to regret. You’re knocking off good voices here precisely at the moment when a conversation like this is ready to turn. Folks have gotten their feelings out in the open, a necessary precondition for reconciliation. This is a damn opportunity to build an even more vibrant and cohesive community. Don’t let it pass. The other path leads in the direction of disease and sorrow. To paraphrase Dutch Reagan, this is a time for choosing.

Everyone needs to grab a copy of John Stewart Mill’s On Liberty and investigate his thoughts on free speech. He articulates my position. Speech must be fully wide open if we are to have any hope of advancing a robust and just culture. Often the more difficult contests are the most heuristic – conflict is good. It is only through a sharp and rigorously explored dialectic that knowledge is sharpened, wisdom gained.

Of course part of the problem here is that we have come to think of places like this as public space. It is not, and the sad fact is that there is very little truly public space left in America. Stake it out and be brave. Short term difficulty will yield long term strength.

And God or whatever one believes in knows we need strength.

"The limits of my language mean the limits of my world" -- Ludwig Wittgenstein

by SubLime on Nov 12, 2011 10:00 AM EST reply actions   1 recs

Stuart damnit...

And I know better — Stuart of Bute has always been my mnemonic device on this.

"The limits of my language mean the limits of my world" -- Ludwig Wittgenstein

by SubLime on Nov 12, 2011 1:43 PM EST up reply actions  

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