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Around SBN: Win or Lose, Boston Celtics' New Big 3 Era A Success

Todd Blackledge vs. Kerry Collins: Pick one

Preface: Remember that you are allowed, encouraged even, to make an emotional decision here. This is not necessarily about who's the greatest. As for previous polls, well, come on, Hunt and Poslusnzy are obviously the greatest.

I know what's going to happen here. Collins is going to win, and quite possibly by an easy margin. Why?

1) The majority of people here are probably too young to remember Blackledge.

2) Collins had a longer pro career.

3) People who are too young to remember either have most likely heard from their parents and others the fresher memories about Collins.

Well, you're all wrong. Wrong! Forget you!

Kerry Collins is the greatest Penn State quarterback ever. But Todd Blackledge is in elite company. Blackledge, Curt Warner, Lydell Mitchell, Shane Conlan, Tamba Hali, Mike Reid, Blair Thomas, Greg Buttle, Shorty Miller, Bruce Clark, and Lenny Moore are the coolest Penn State players ever. Moreover, Todd Blackledge was awesome.

Who here has ever seen the 1982 Nebraska game? I'm too young to have it watched it live, but I have it on DVD. And, my word, Todd freaking Blackledge.

Nebraska took a 24-21 lead late in the 4th quarter, their first lead of the game. Blackledge, who is now without his good buddy Curt "Herschel is a walker, Warner is a runner" Warner, out with a leg injury, doesn't panic. He navigates Penn State down the field, through a third down conversion, a wicked sweet fourth down conversion with Kenny Jackson on the receiving end, and a second down pass to Mike McCloskey at the five that was too close to call an "outrageous referee call" you stupid Nebraska pillocks. Oh, and then he worked the play action perfectly for the touchdown pass to Kirk Bowman. Game. Blouses.

Collins had his drives, of course. The 98 yarder against Illinois and the game winner in the 4th quarter. The game winner against Michigan that same year. And, one of my favorites, the great drives against Notre Dame in '92 in a losing effort.

But Blackledge was cooler. His style of play was simply cooler, more fun to watch, and I just love him. He always gave me the impression of being in a state of making up for something (He was pretty small in comparison to Collins and his arm strength wasn't all-world), whereas Collins was so obviously perfect in almost every regard.

Also, in 1982, my Dad and Todd Blackledge looked almost identical. Long, casually-trimmed hair, sweet mustaches, coolness. Ah, the early '80s.

Poll
Choose
Todd Blackledge
65 votes
Kerry Collins
98 votes

163 votes | Poll has closed

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This gives me a good idea for the one tomorrow

Also, agreed on Blackledge. Even though I might like Kerry more as a player, think Blackledge was better.

"We're going to do all we can to get this team right, to go after that national championship" - Devon Still

by ICEICETHATGUY13 on Aug 4, 2011 10:03 AM EDT reply actions  

Gotta be Shaffer v. Burkhart

Who best managed dominating, undefeated teams.

Striving for Success with Honor

by Frank O'Brien on Aug 4, 2011 4:22 PM EDT up reply actions  

Shaffer, unquestionably.

Know why? Because Chuck Burkhart was one of those vintage quarterbacks who threw mostly long passes and had an atrocious completion percentage. To my eyes, he is absolutely terrible. His best passing plays were never that impressive because he was throwing in the flat to Lydell Mitchell so Lydell could do his thing or he was throwing to a wide open Ted Kwalick because Ted Kwalick was awesome.

Shaffer wasn’t terrible, he didn’t play on a team with a defense as truly dominant as ‘68-’69 (The 1986 defense was great, but they did have their games where they tried to give us heart issues), and his lone loss, to Oklahoma, I blame on Massimo Manca and the refs missing a clipping on that stupid Keith Jackson touchdown catch.

"Nein, ich bin Schnappi das kleine Krokodil."

by ReadingRambler on Aug 4, 2011 9:18 PM EDT up reply actions  

I am afraid that series is going to kill him eventually

especially if he keeps doing games in B1G country

ACCEPTS THE PAYPAL
Hello, everybody, coach get old, the new coach approaching, click in.
Welcome to http://www.pennlive.com

by newenglandnittanylion on Aug 4, 2011 11:41 AM EDT up reply actions  

I'm definitely too young to have seen Blackledge on anything except a Southern Lion DVD.

What do you mean cooler?

That’s not snark, I’m legit intrigued.

All I want to do is make the whole crowd bounce, y'all

I was that guy, Adam Collyer. Now, I'm that guy, Adam Collyer
@AdamCollyer
Black Shoe Diaries

by Adam Collyer on Aug 4, 2011 10:32 AM EDT reply actions  

I really don't quite know how to describe it.

He had the same sort of confidence and leadership skills as Collins, but it just seemed more natural coming from Collins. After all, Collins was this big dude who looked like he had been a quarterback when he left the womb. It never seemed as easy for Blackledge.

Then there was his playing style. Again, I don’t quite know how to describe it. You should probably just get the ’82 Nebraska game, but I think what I mean is something like this:

Against Oregon on one play, Kerry slipped down almost to his knees, recovered, and then threw a gorgeous, simply gorgeous pass to Freddie Scott, who had been running a post pattern to the back of the endzone. Scott dropped what would have been a tough catch (Yeah, Engram would have caught it), robbing us of one of the greatest total plays in PSU history, but it was still awesome.

I think Blackledge could have made the same play, only he would have looked like he was working harder to make it happen. I guess that’s what I mean. Blackledge and Collins both made the art of quarterbacking as beautiful as it can be, but Blackledge, to me, looked like he had worked his balls off to go beyond his “natural” range.

Also, I loved how often he seemed to be jumping when he passed:

"Nein, ich bin Schnappi das kleine Krokodil."

by ReadingRambler on Aug 4, 2011 11:14 AM EDT up reply actions  

Whatever happened to football players wearing customized towels?

I've decided that it is a legitimate possibility that the Pirates might be decent.

by jesse. on Aug 5, 2011 12:18 PM EDT up reply actions  

The game gets lamer every year.

Just look at WVU.

WVU, 1982:

All right!

WVU, present:

AAAAAAGH!

"Nein, ich bin Schnappi das kleine Krokodil."

by ReadingRambler on Aug 5, 2011 12:49 PM EDT up reply actions  

in that top photo, you would not have to tackle him

just tickle his belly.

I am being super unproductive today.

"Fish aren't smart. It's not like they have advanced degrees."
Mike Leach - Arrrrrrrrrr

by letsgopsu on Aug 5, 2011 2:45 PM EDT up reply actions  

Collins

Collins. Kerry Collins.

"I don’t know what he’s done differently, whether he’s eating differently or Sue is making him happier, but he’s definitely a different coach out there" Devon Still

by jman07 on Aug 4, 2011 10:38 AM EDT reply actions  

Collins was my first "celebrity" crush

and though Blackledge is awesome, and has always represented himself and the University with upmost integrity, I’ve gotta go Kerry ftw.

Fire Dan Snyder

by Cari Greene on Aug 4, 2011 10:45 AM EDT reply actions  

Easy

Collins. But mostly because he was from my area, went to my high school, and when I was in 3rd grade (1995), he came back and signed autographs at my elementary school.

"He's a beast. But so am I. So let the beasting begin."

by PSUtopia on Aug 4, 2011 11:24 AM EDT reply actions  

I went with Blackledge,

mainly because he was the qb of the first PSU teams I can remember following as a kid. Plus, he had one of those great wispy mustaches.

Word on the street is you're a jerk, Mitchell.

by icavalera on Aug 4, 2011 11:27 AM EDT reply actions  

I took Collins.

In 1994 Collins was a monster. And absolute machine. He was close to setting a record for the highest QB rating ever that season. He seemed to be able to simple do no wrong.

To me, for all his greatness and everything Blackledge represented, he commited treason when he supported Nebraska in 1994 instead of going to bat for us.

30 DAYS 15 MINUTES 19 SECONDS UNTIL KICKOFF!!!

by Ab4PSU on Aug 4, 2011 11:44 AM EDT reply actions  

It's been so long that I don't remember the specifics, but I do remember watching him

on TV and the subject came up and I don’t remember exactly what he said (probably because I went off the fucking deep end) but I do remember he sided with Nebraska over us for #1. I know for an absolute fact he did because it so thoroughly disgusted me.

I’m sure he did it because his broadcasting career was young and he wanted to appear impartial and all, but still. That tainted him somewhat in my eyes after that.

by Ab4PSU on Aug 4, 2011 11:53 AM EDT up reply actions  

I don't believe you and I won't.

"Nein, ich bin Schnappi das kleine Krokodil."

by ReadingRambler on Aug 4, 2011 1:55 PM EDT up reply actions  

Love Blackledge, but...

… I voted for Kerry, because I believe he is probably the greatest QB to ever don the Blue & White. Tough to beat that. Respect your arguments for Blackledge though.

I will definitely, however, give Todd the “Cooler Post-NFL Profession” hands-down, as calorie-killing college football analyst trumps country music singer/songwriter in my book.

by PSU_Buch on Aug 4, 2011 11:49 AM EDT reply actions  

I think that

another PSU Legend (Our greatest D Lineman ever) might disagree with you on the cooler post-football profession.

by nits4ever on Aug 4, 2011 9:47 PM EDT up reply actions  

oops rec for the fix

My grammer skills need improved.

by BMAN13 on Aug 4, 2011 2:21 PM EDT up reply actions  

So basically all I've to do is write that and people will rec it?

What happens if I post this? Will you send me a beautiful, responsible, and intelligent she-robot, complete with dowry, for me to marry?

"Nein, ich bin Schnappi das kleine Krokodil."

by ReadingRambler on Aug 4, 2011 10:17 PM EDT up reply actions  

here you go

"Fish aren't smart. It's not like they have advanced degrees."
Mike Leach - Arrrrrrrrrr

by letsgopsu on Aug 4, 2011 10:52 PM EDT up reply actions  

OMG!!!

"Nein, ich bin Schnappi das kleine Krokodil."

by ReadingRambler on Aug 4, 2011 11:02 PM EDT up reply actions  

I don't want to have to choose.

I was at PSU for Blackledge, so I remember both. Both great QB’s, with lots of talent around them.

A couple comments, though. The game that sticks out to me for Collins, that nobody mentions, was the 1993 Indiana game. We were coming off back to back losses to Michigan & O$U, & Indiana was giving us a REAL tough time. Collins took over and won it on a couple bombs. He showed right there what he was capable of, and didn’t lose a game from there on.

Both offenses used a play we never run anymore. Send the wideouts on short out routes, and send the half back deep down the middle. I remember Warner doing that a couple times for td’s, and I think Carter did, too.

by No.21 on Aug 4, 2011 12:55 PM EDT reply actions  

Didn't DWill

do that vs. Illinois in 2008? Or was that a wheel route?

Joe Paterno Apologist

by Joe 96alum on Aug 4, 2011 1:04 PM EDT up reply actions  

Wheel route

All I want to do is make the whole crowd bounce, y'all

I was that guy, Adam Collyer. Now, I'm that guy, Adam Collyer
@AdamCollyer
Black Shoe Diaries

by Adam Collyer on Aug 4, 2011 1:54 PM EDT up reply actions  

Carter didn't do it.

That was probably Archie.

"Nein, ich bin Schnappi das kleine Krokodil."

by ReadingRambler on Aug 4, 2011 1:55 PM EDT up reply actions  

1994 Wheel Route

I recall Archie running it-and throwing the occasional pass. I think he threw a long one during the first half of the MSU game (away from the North End Zone where my then 4 year old son was attending his first PSU game ever).

by nits4ever on Aug 4, 2011 9:45 PM EDT up reply actions  

Was Blackledge the QB for 48-14?

I appreciate your favoring of Blackledge, but I have to go with Collins just because the ‘94 offense was just so explosive and you can’t ignore those numbers. That and ’94 was my first fall semester on campus and thus the first games I attended at Beaver Stadium.

Joe Paterno Apologist

by Joe 96alum on Aug 4, 2011 1:07 PM EDT reply actions  

Yes, that was Blackledge.

Also, two things: 1) the 1982 offense was plenty explosive, and 2) the 1982 offense probably would have been almost as good as the 1994 offense if the offensive line wasn’t in a rebuilding year. That’s why we leaned so much on Blackledge and why it took so long for Curt to get going. Blackledge didn’t have Hartings, Rivera, Greeley, Andre Johnson, etc.

"Nein, ich bin Schnappi das kleine Krokodil."

by ReadingRambler on Aug 4, 2011 1:57 PM EDT up reply actions  

this is unpossible

everyone knows we’ve relied solely on the run game for forever.

Fire Dan Snyder

by Cari Greene on Aug 4, 2011 3:14 PM EDT up reply actions   2 recs

It was also the first team to win a national championship

whie playing the most difficult schedule of any team that year.

by Smee on Aug 4, 2011 11:21 PM EDT up reply actions  

also unpossible

because everyone knows we played a cupcake schedule before joining the Big Ten.

Fire Dan Snyder

by Cari Greene on Aug 5, 2011 8:19 AM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

the 1982 offense probably would have been almost as good as the 1994 offense if the offensive line wasn’t in a rebuilding year

and if my aunt had a D—- she would be my uncle

Reporter: Can you give us a touchdown celebration, one that you would get penalized for?
Moye: I play at Penn State. I don’t celebrate.

by psupride on Aug 4, 2011 2:45 PM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

Todd Blackledge is better than Collins.

And since you could go against such a universal truth, I, frankly, wouldn’t be surprised by your aunt’s uncle-like behavior and appearance.

"Nein, ich bin Schnappi das kleine Krokodil."

by ReadingRambler on Aug 4, 2011 2:57 PM EDT up reply actions  

my aunt's uncle like behaivor and appearance?

I’m not the one from the Alabama in the middle of Philly and Pitt….

Reporter: Can you give us a touchdown celebration, one that you would get penalized for?
Moye: I play at Penn State. I don’t celebrate.

by psupride on Aug 5, 2011 11:51 AM EDT up reply actions  

Keep repeating that quote.

It may be true for city slickers who think Timothy is a person’s name instead of what it is (Hay), but it’s not true for real men.

"Nein, ich bin Schnappi das kleine Krokodil."

by ReadingRambler on Aug 5, 2011 12:02 PM EDT up reply actions  

1982 O Line

You are correct-both Farrell and Munchak left after the 1981 season (Munchak early as I recall).

by nits4ever on Aug 4, 2011 9:43 PM EDT up reply actions  

I was torn

But had to go with Blackledge.

Collins was definitely the more prototypical QB of the 2 and had very few weaknesses in his game. Blackledge though, seemed to will his way past his shortcomings and lead the team to greatness.

Although, now I feel old reading that RR wasn’t old enough to see the real QB14 play live.

by nylyst on Aug 4, 2011 2:00 PM EDT reply actions  

Well, I probably wouldn't have seen much of him anyway.

TCS did a bunch of games, but I’m pretty sure that was available only over the mountains in Pittsburgh. Here in the 717, it would just be what one of the Big Three networks decided to show.

"Nein, ich bin Schnappi das kleine Krokodil."

by ReadingRambler on Aug 4, 2011 2:16 PM EDT up reply actions  

went Collins

The 94 team was the reason I am a fan and only applied to Penn State.

Reporter: Can you give us a touchdown celebration, one that you would get penalized for?
Moye: I play at Penn State. I don’t celebrate.

by psupride on Aug 4, 2011 2:47 PM EDT reply actions  

Slight edge to Blackledge

Blackledge had the much better body of work for his PSU career. 48-14, besting Marino two years in a row, Bowl wins over USC and top ranked Georgia, then there is the MNC. Collins was lightning in a bottle for one fabulous season except saving his poorest least impressive performance for the Rose Bowl over a mediocre Oregon.

Striving for Success with Honor

by Frank O'Brien on Aug 4, 2011 4:16 PM EDT reply actions  

I vote Blackledge

He was the PSU QB when I first started following PSU at the ripe old age of 7.

Plus, I know I’m in the minority here, but until the 1994 season, I hated Kerry Collins. I didn’t think he was all that good, and I was firmly in the John Sacca camp when Sacca got benched in favor of Collins halfway though the 1993 season. I was however, pleasantly surprised how wrong Collins proved me in 1994.

by joe_knows on Aug 4, 2011 4:28 PM EDT reply actions   1 recs

Miami 1992

I guess you don’t remember the absolutely hideous pick 6 John Sacca threw early in the 4th quarter of that game. That more than Fayak’s missed FGs cost us the game-and ultimately the season.

by nits4ever on Aug 4, 2011 8:20 PM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

That interception was thrown to the entire Miami defensive line.

I've decided that it is a legitimate possibility that the Pirates might be decent.

by jesse. on Aug 5, 2011 12:22 PM EDT up reply actions   2 recs

I was low in the end zone they scored in...

…it happened in slow motion.

I've decided that it is a legitimate possibility that the Pirates might be decent.

by jesse. on Aug 5, 2011 1:00 PM EDT up reply actions  

Slow motion

this appeared on BHGP last night and it and made me cry from laughing

"Fish aren't smart. It's not like they have advanced degrees."
Mike Leach - Arrrrrrrrrr

by letsgopsu on Aug 5, 2011 2:47 PM EDT up reply actions  

Good Lord! Gutsy.

I’m going to rec this just because I can’t believe you actually admitted to supporting John Sacca! That’s a first!

Do you remember the 1993 USC game? Sacca was awful.

"Nein, ich bin Schnappi das kleine Krokodil."

by ReadingRambler on Aug 4, 2011 9:21 PM EDT up reply actions  

Yes I remember USC 1993

The following week Sacca was pulled from the Iowa game-which was not close (31-0 PSU final). That was the game which prompted the infamous “This offense sucks!” comment by Dick Vermeil. Shortly thereafter Sacca thankfully departed Happy Valley.

by nits4ever on Aug 4, 2011 9:37 PM EDT up reply actions  

Vermiel's line was more like

“Penn State’s passing game sucks!”, as Carter was having a great game that day.

Word on the street is you're a jerk, Mitchell.

by icavalera on Aug 5, 2011 8:40 AM EDT up reply actions  

To be fair

Collins was pretty awful throughout a good chuck of 93 and even 92 as well.

In 1993, Collins barely completed 50 percent of his passes, and threw 11 interceptions, some of which were just as bad as Sacca’s pick 6 against Indiana, which I do, in fact, remember.

That said, I recognize now that Collins was the better QB. It’s just that at that time, I didn’t think Kerry was any better than Sacca the younger.

Boy, was I wrong.

by joe_knows on Aug 4, 2011 9:36 PM EDT up reply actions  

Writing fail

I meant Miami, not Indiana.

by joe_knows on Aug 4, 2011 9:37 PM EDT up reply actions  

Collins in 1993

I won’t defend the way he played against OSU in the snow at Columbus and at home two weeks later against Illiinois in a cold hard rain (He was booed a bit during that game). But 2 weeks later he led the comeback at MSU which was a springboard to the following season-our greatest offensive team ever-led by our greatest QB ever.

by nits4ever on Aug 4, 2011 9:41 PM EDT up reply actions  

The MSU game in 1993

Was the first game where I kind of warmed up to him, because he played very well.

But going into the 1994 season, I was filled with trepidation about our QB situation. Again, I was way off.

by joe_knows on Aug 4, 2011 9:50 PM EDT up reply actions  

Collins over Blackledge

but IMO this was a tougher call than Poz over Lavar.

by nits4ever on Aug 4, 2011 8:15 PM EDT reply actions  

Any poll missing Morelli is flawed.

How many other Penn State QBs have had the student section chant “F*%# (insert last name)” clap clap clapclapclap during a game ("07 Iowa)? We even won that game.

Doesn’t get much better than that.

"I'll have a scotch and water, hold the scotch."

by bent rIMs on Aug 4, 2011 8:20 PM EDT reply actions  

Meh.

They chanted “F*$% Ohio” before our mandatory drubbing of Youngstown State.

"Nein, ich bin Schnappi das kleine Krokodil."

by ReadingRambler on Aug 4, 2011 9:21 PM EDT up reply actions  

Collins is the easy winner for me

Mainly because he was at the helm when 7 year old me discovered the greatness that is Penn State Football.

But also because part of me has always wanted to go on a bye week bender with the Raiders with Collins and Sebastian Janikowski leading the way.

I am a Penn State Nittany Lion, and I played for the legendary Joe Paterno, and more importantly, I am a man because of it. - Lavar Arrington

by LegalLion on Aug 4, 2011 10:21 PM EDT reply actions  

Voted for Collins

because his 1994 numbers are like the 1912 PSU defensive stats: they’re so good they don’t even make sense.

That being said, Blackledge’s pro career was just a shame. He was the first coming of David Carr: tons of talent but still a statue pocket passer behind a miserable offensive line. He got the crap beat out of him for a few years straight. We will never know how good he could have been as a pro.

is there anyway i can redeem myself, i was not sure if i should say "we" at that moment
by Skins4ever on Feb 2, 2010 7:56 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

by ckmneon on Aug 5, 2011 10:41 PM EDT reply actions  

Well stated

Hire Mike Pettine Jr!!!!!!!!

by SweepTheLeg on Aug 6, 2011 9:13 AM EDT up reply actions  

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